Question & Answer Board

 Q2544 C.T. Ham?  Just picked up this lantern for $35 at a nearby antique shop. Not like I need another lantern project, am waiting for the weather to break to start soaking the crossing lantern, but how can you resist them? It had an incorrect Dietz Globe in it, but I think it might be a C.T. Ham. However, the only marking is on the base, it is 'No. 39' and no C.T. Ham. It was nickeled at one time, but most is gone and has cracks in the brass around the base of the globe. I’m sure the Dietz Globe didn’t help! Appreciate any thoughts anyone might have on it. Best Regards!   [Click on image for larger version.] Posted Monday, April 8, 2013 by Mike   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. They meant a fire fighter. The traingle was a hanging hook. Posted Monday, April 8, 2013 by BK

A. Forgot to add... if I find any more will let you know!! :-)  Posted Monday, April 8, 2013 by MAS

A. Posted also over on a lantern Facebook page and had several responses that this was a RR Fireman's Lantern, as per the triangular loop at the top. Thoughts? Posted Monday, April 8, 2013 by MAS

A. OK, I'll display my ignorance... :-) You mean a regular 'firetruck - building' type firefighter or a Railroad FF? I know early on their were all kinds of problems with fires along the tracks (Grew up next to some old lines). Also, any thoughts on the age of this one? - Thanks! Posted Monday, April 8, 2013 by MAS

A. Take a look at the front cover of "Lanterns That Lit our World-Book Two" by Anthony Hobson, there is a line drawing of your lantern. And then check out pages 33 and 34. It is a C.T. Ham No.39 Hooded Fireman's Lantern, or it might be the No.39 Ring Top Fireman's Lantern. Both came in brass, or nickel plated, and Hobson dates them from 1887 to 1914. The Ring Top shows a more rounded shape on the top similar to a Conductor's lantern. Both lanterns used lard oil and yours should have the heat exchanger wire that loops over the flame and down into the font to preheat the lard oil. Are there two holes on the top of the font where the wire went in? The Hooded lantern also had an outside ratchet wick raiser. I can't tell from the photo, maybe your burner and font was changed to a more modern one that used kero. The triangular hook was used to hang the lantern to a bracket on the fire apparatus. Check out Dietz Fire King fire department lanterns and you will see the same triangular loop on the top, and they were made until around 1940. Other fire department lantern questions which are in the Archives are Q1261, 1664, 1839 and 2432. Does the antique store have a second one for $35.00?? Posted Monday, April 8, 2013 by KM

A. Thank you KM for the most thorough description! Don't have the book, but will try to get it from our library. However, I did find a picture of the cover and 'dang' it sure looks like the same lantern! There is actually one hole on the top of the burner, and the slide that feeds the wick looks like it may have been replaced at some time as it is 'cruder' than the rest of the burner. This was at one time nickle plated, but it looks like repeated polishing has washed away most of the nickle finish. Doesn't look heavily, as in recently, cleaned, but just wear from constant polishing. Traces of the nickle are on the font and burner top also. What an interesting lantern. Would it have taken a clear globe? Many thanks again and Best regards!  Posted Monday, April 8, 2013 by MAS

A.  A #39 railroad lantern globe (5&3/8" tall) will fit in it so you can look for one that is marked C.T. Ham or buy an unmarked reproduction one. Some departments used a clear globe with a magnifier lens that was cast into the globe. I have one Ham railroad lantern that has the magnifier lens and it is marked Ham. Ususally they used clear or red globes, but in special cases they had different colors or two color globes. The cracks that you describe in the globe seat are stress cracks which are very common on brass lanterns, and other antique brass parts like auto or truck headlights, spotlights and taillights. They occur because the brass part was spun to form it which stretches out the metal and makes thin spots. Hobson's first book may be at your library, Book Two may not be. Both are out of print and eBay prices for them have escalated in the last few years. A copy of Book Two is not easy to find. Golden Hill Press was the publisher.  Posted Tuesday, April 9, 2013 by KM

A. Hopefully as a clarification, I would note that in Hobson (Book 1?) in both the Dietz and the Steam Gage and Lantern sections he notes no. 39 lanterns with hanging rings 'a standard size used on the railroads, with a fire lantern ring on top, it is the railroad fireman's lantern....' and '('Fireman' here refers to the fireman on the railroad.)' These lanterns in the railroad listings date only up to 1900 or so. Prior to that time electric lights were rare on locomotives; and gauge lights provided very little light in the cab. As seen in many other questions, the locomotive engineer had his kerosene torch for light, but the locomotive fireman had nothing, and would frequently want a hanging light such as could be provided by these lanterns, for example to see the fuel supply back in the tender, and for watching the water flowing into the tender at water stops. (Some of those water tanks were in REALLY desolate places -- no ambient light at all!) For that service a clear globe giving maximum illumination would be appropriate. Once turbogenerators and electric lights became common, the fireman wouldn't need to bring his own lantern and these were dropped from the catalogs. But a lot of the firefighters still needed kerosene lanterns for quite a while yet. Posted Sunday, April 14, 2013 by RJMc

A.  The Dietz and Steam Gauge lanterns show a round circle ring on top, not a triangular hook. A friend has a large fire department lantern collection (about 40 lanterns) has many that have wheel cut globes that are dedicated to specific fire companies or officers and most of them have the triangular hook. He does have a few Dietz #39 and one Steam Gauge that may have come from fire departments, but who can say,like any other lantern they could have been used for any purpose. Posted Sunday, April 14, 2013 by KM

 Q2541 Info on Lamps Needed  Hi. I just want to know where these might originate, from the cylindrical shaped lamp has the letters MRD and I have no idea about that one or the cube shaped lamp which has no makings what so ever. If you could help me out at all I would be so grateful. Thank you.   [Click on image for larger version.] Posted Thursday, April 4, 2013 by DN   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A.  The cylindrical device looks like a chicken coop heater to me. Does it have a Miller #3 burner in it, they are very common in chicken coop or brooder heaters.the square lamp may be from a European railroad. Posted Thursday, April 4, 2013 by KM

A. The square lamp appears British. If it has just the clear lens, as shown, it is probably a locomotive headlamp, if there is a red lens on the other side then it is a brake-van (caboose) lamp. The cylindrical lamp is intriguing. I agree with KM that it is most likely a brooder heater, but the MRD marking is often found on items from the (British) Midland Railway, standing for Midland Railway, Derby. Probably a coincidence!  Posted Friday, April 5, 2013 by JAJ

A.  The thought occurred to me after my first post that the heater could have been used in a brake van. I looked at photos of vans that are posted on the net and I don't see smoke stacks for stoves on many of them. some of them are not much larger than a chicken coop So maybe it was a heater that was used in a van. Most of them have corner brackets where the lamp would have hung. The link shows a van with three lamps on it and it does have a smoke stack for a stove.  Link 1  Posted Friday, April 5, 2013 by KM

A. Having a close inspection of the cylindrical lantern on the inside near where it clips down are the words "Appleton's patent" Appletons electric co. Chicago since 1903. they produced lighting for roadside,oil rigs etc but i wouldn't mind narrowing it down to see what it actually is Thanks heaps guys i'll look up chicken coop heater cheers and if you don't mind are these thing rare or anything like that  Posted Thursday, April 11, 2013 by DJ

A. The square lantern has markings on the rim of the lenses that say '5 0 x 4.5 F.D (NOM) England' and the cylindrical lantern has 'Appleton's patent' embossed just near where the lid clips down on the inside to the body of it. With information received i would please like the manufactured date and what they were used for and who used them. Thank you for the information I have received in return so far has been great. Thank you.  Posted Friday, April 12, 2013 by DN

A. "Appletons Patent" usually applies to a type of British railway handlamp manufactured by a firm based in Birmingham, England. They made lamps of various types and I guess that the cylindrical lamp is one of their products. If it has any railway connection, it must be pretty obscure. It would not be used as a brake van heater as these vehicles were always provided with coal stoves, not small oil heaters. Although their bodies were small, at least when compared with a caboose, they were extremely drafty and required a substantial heat source (if only to boil a kettle for the guard's tea!) Regarding age and rarity, the square lamp probably dates from before the nationalisation of the British railway companies in 1948 and is fairly unusual. If the cylindrical lamp has a railway provenance (re the MRD marking) it would date from before 1923, when the Midland Railway became part of the London, Midland & Scottish Railway.  Posted Wednesday, April 17, 2013 by JAJ

A. I have just come across your question when searching for information regarding Appleton Hand Signal Lamps. My G Grandfather patented these 'spinner' type signal lamps in England for use by railways staff as a simple way to change the signal from red to green. On his return to Australia in 1908 he began manufacturing the signal lamps here in Brisbane at a small family run factory in Sherwood. The lamps were highly sought after by the railway employees at the time and many were sold to Queensland, New South Wales and Victorian Railways. Your cylindrical lamp is a 'warning lamp' that the firm later manufactured for sale to various local council authorities for use as a roadside warning lamp usually placed around excavations and other roadworks during the night hours. The MRD stamping on your lamp denotes that is was owned by the 'Main Roads Department' our State Government road building authority. The burner inside will more than likely have AE APPLETON SHERWOOD embossed around the edge of the wick winder. I would be very keen to correspond with anyone having any knowledge of the manufacture and use of the APPLETON signal lamps in England.  Posted Saturday, February 28, 2015 by Doug Appleton

 Q2536 Railroad Switchstand  I have a Ramapo Ironworks tall switchstand that is a No 28. This switchstand has no patent number, but does have about 4 different patent dates. Can anyone tell me how to find the patent information? You guys helped me before with my Racor 17C and that one had a patent number on it. Looking up that patent number worked like a charm (schematics). A Ramapo Ironworks No 28 kind of looks like a Ramapo Ironworks 17. Thanks.  Posted Tuesday, April 2, 2013 by Greg   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. First check the dates on an on line Perpetual Calendar to see if they fall on a Tuesday because all US patents are issued on Tuesdays and frequently I find wrong dates. Then log into "Google Paternt Search" enter the date and that should give you all of the patents that were issued that day ten to a page. You may have to scroll through several hundred patents to find what you are looking for, but it is usually entertaining to see what all gets patented. Or just enter Ramapo and/or switchstand and maybe you get lucky and only the right patents turn up. The patent may or may not have been assigned to Ramapo so it might show up in the search. Google Patent Search is pretty easy to use. If the stand has four dates it is possible that only some parts and not the whole stand are what the dates refer to, so when you start to scroll through the patents keep that in mind.  Posted Tuesday, April 2, 2013 by KM

A. Your previous question is Q1921 in the Archives, also check Q1911 which is about a Ramapo or Racor (Ramapo Ajax Corp.) switch stand. Searching "Ramapo switch stand in Google patent search yielded about 12 patents with dates rangeing from the 1880's to the 1930's. I did not try to search Racor, that might give more recent results. Lucky for you the company name is Ramapo and not just Ajax, Smith, Brown Acme, or some other very common name.  Posted Tuesday, April 2, 2013 by KM

 Q2535 Adlake Two-Color Globes?  I saw either on your web site or another a few two color Adlake globes filmed at a railroad show that were a dark signal green and clear like those used on conductors lanterns. Were these genuine and did such a item exist?? I have noticed that two color globes were also made for standard type lanterns. Thank you. [Web Editor: I believe the question is about 'short' two-color globes].  Posted Sunday, March 31, 2013 by Keith   Post a Reply  Email a reply

 Q2533 New Haven Railroad Initials?  I have a Dietz No. 39 Standard bell bottom lantern marked N.H. Ry. I am unable to confirm its identity. A prominent and knowledgeable collector told me that it is a New Haven RR, i.e. NYNH&H, lantern. I greatly respect his opinion, but remain skeptical. A friend who is very knowledgeable on the New Haven pointed out to me that 'Railway' was never part of their corporate name and the shortening of NYNH&H to just NH came late in the game, well after this lantern was manufactured. Hardware was marked NYNH&H. But, I can find no other company, trolley or shortline, based in New Haven, Hew Hampshire, or anywhere else, with the initials NH Ry. The closest I found is New Hampshire Electric Railways. Not knowing anything about this company, I would expect their hardware to be marked NHE Ry. So, either Dietz made an egregious marking error (one might expect that from Handlan, but not Dietz), or it is from another company yet to be discovered, or ??? Any knowledge out on this lantern or these initials?  Posted Saturday, March 30, 2013 by SB   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. It would be very time consuming, but Wikipedia lists for each state in the union, currently operating RR lines and also defunct lines. These lists are as comprehensive as you will find and very inclusive. There are a number of different ways to search. I've found Wikipedia incredibly helpful. Even if you still can't determine a reasonable guess, it may be useful for something else.  Posted Saturday, April 6, 2013 by Jane

 Q2532 Duplex lens and inverted fresnel lenses  This might be for Red Beard but anyone else also. I have in my collection of a series of different colored Fresnel style lenses that I believe are called Duplex. The refractionary ridges are on the outside of the curved surface. In other words, it’s like you took a regular Fresnel lamp lens and flipped it inside out. I’ve never seen these used anywhere. Any comments on these? Also, some company catalog books show a Fresnel lens placed what I would term backwards in the lamp with the curved edge very close to the flame and then a clear cover lens placed over it and facing outward like the normal lens would be. Again, I’ve never seen that done or used.  Posted Tuesday, March 26, 2013 by TJ   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. Hi TJ: I'm going to let DJB start the comments on this one as Duplex lens setups are a signal application. Do you have a link for any of those catalog pages? --- ....Red Beard Posted Wednesday, March 27, 2013 by Red Beard the Railroad Raider

A. Hello TJ and Red.I am only going to address this subject from the perspective of being a former signal employee and on what I am familiar with on these 2 subjects.On the fresnel lenses,the type with the outside ribbing is the most common type I have seen and we used this style on all our RR swing bridge channel and clearance lamps, as they were technically a coast guard requirement rather than an AAR signal section req.I have never seen the type of fresnel lense with the smooth outside and ribs inside.Nor the use of an outside clear cover lense used with these.These lenses were usually only a 90 or 180 degree segment type lense and not a full closed cirle.Perhaps they were much more common in areas of the US with large maritime operations.If I am confusing your questions about DUPLEX lenses with INVERTED lenses,here is your answer on those.I am now going to assume you mean an actual RR kerosene signal lamp lens with the raised rings on the outside,like one would use in a semaphore type lamp? Those are called INVERTED lens,not DUPLEX.These lens were used where a much more powerful beam of light was wanted with the same type of signal burner and oil consumption.They were used with a smooth concave clear roundel as a cover lense to make cleaning much easier.In my experience,the inverted lens was usually larger,like 6-3/8 inch vs 5-3/8 inch but all other lamp parts were the same.These inverted lense lamps are quite rare I believe as RR's seemed to like a particular model of kerosene lamp and stuck with it for decades.Here is possibility #3 in your questions.I am very suspicious that you are possibly talking about the inner, colored,ribbed lenses,usually 5-1/2 inch diameter,commonly used inside the electric block signal lamps made by US&S,GRS and Safetran Corp,and mounted behind the clear 8-3/8 inch outer optical lens.In this application,they are known as colored DOUBLET lenses,not DUPLEX.The term Duplex lens is actually unknown to me for that matter.I hope all this info made sense to you and believe me,My intentions were to educate you and not confuse the issue.If you need me to try this again,just ask.Thanks,DJB Posted Thursday, March 28, 2013 by DJB

A. Two comments: the term DUPLEX fresnel lens is definitely used by the Coast Guard to describe light house lenses....which have been various types of (very large) Fresnel lenses since their lighthouses were lit with kerosene. Second, there were railroad marker light and signal lamp lenses which had the usual rings inside and straight ribs outside; they were the standard diameters and interchangeable in most lamps. These were probably not acquired new after the 1920's or so. I believe these were used to get a broader, flatter beam pattern, for example to help see the lamp in territory with curved track where the oncoming train was approaching at an angle rather than straight on to the lamp. It is possible these were called duplex, but I have been unable to find info on them in any of the catalogs here on this site or elsewhere. ADDITIONAL NOTE to avoid confusion to all: there are two of us replying here on the site with initials 'RJM'. I have been using 'RJMc' to distinguish the two.  Posted Thursday, March 28, 2013 by RJMc

A. For RJMc,The name of the ribbed railroad lenses to which you refer to is SPREDLITE which are standard size lenses with external ribs to,as you say,bend the light beam somewhat.These work well for the job they do,but they do sacrifice a certain amount of beam intensity compared to that of a standard optical type signal lense.So, these were not referred to as DUPLEX lenses in the railroad business.DJB  Posted Thursday, March 28, 2013 by DJB

A. Much thanx to DJB and RJMc and of course as usual Red Beard. Your detailed descriptions were most helpful as this particular item was something I had no idea about. For that reason, I used the term Duplex lens as it showed in the Illustrated Encyclopedia of Railroad Lighting--Vol. 2, on page 331 and the term Inverted Lens on page 329, to describe what I was asking about when it came to that question. Once again much thanks for great information and the time that it took to answer.  Posted Saturday, March 30, 2013 by TJ

 Q2530 CSRR Kero Marking  A late-model Adlake Kero has shown up on an internet auction site with the marking 'CS. RR'. Does anyone know what these initials stand for? Thanks.  Posted Monday, March 25, 2013 by TF   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. If it is a newer looking lantern, it could be from a tourist line. They have been known to mark their lanterns. Or maybe even sell marked lanterns in their gift shop?? Cass Scenic RR, Conway Scenic RR, etc. Posted Tuesday, March 26, 2013 by DA

 Q2526 Lantern Info Needed  I have an old lantern with a glass globe which is stamped A & W MFG Chicago, pat Jan 21, 1880. I can't find anything about this company in Chicago. Have you any idea where i could look?   [Click on image for larger version.] Posted Thursday, March 21, 2013 by JM   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. "A&W" on anything related to lighting, and around Chicago, is almost certainly Adams & Westlake Co., subsequently abbreviated to 'Adlake'. They are still in the railway supply business today; the link is to their website which describes the company history.  Link 1  Posted Thursday, March 21, 2013 by RJMc

A. This is a parade torch. A pole is inserted in the round holder to hold it so it will stay vertical. They were mainly used for political rallies and the like. Posted Friday, March 22, 2013 by RK

A.  You could try and search for the patent on Google Patent Search, but the date 1/21/1880 was a Wednesday, and US patents are issued on Tuesdays so the search may not come up with anything. it is not unusual for a patent date that is displayed on items to be wrong.  Posted Friday, March 22, 2013 by KM

A.  This is a "ballot box" parade torch,shaped like a ballot box and used at election times. It has a glass font or tank(which doesn't show very well in your photo) for the kerosene and the 4 tubed structure around that protects it. See the link which shows one that was sold in 2003. It should be only 4X4X4 inches? Also see Q2094 and 2027 in the Archives for other styles of parade torches. Link 1  Posted Friday, March 22, 2013 by KM

A. This link shows a parade torch which is attached to a hat that was made by Benziger in Chicago. I sorta wonder how safe that was.  Link 1  Posted Friday, March 22, 2013 by KM

A.  This link shows a cartoon that depicts Boss Tweed standing by a glass globe type ballot box. They used colored paper ballots for different parties back then so an observer or enforcer could tell which party the voter had just cast the ballot for.  Link 1  Posted Friday, March 22, 2013 by KM

A.  J. McGregor Adams arrived in Chicago in the 1850's and was a partner in the companies which eventually became Adams and Westlake. The patent has an error in his name at the top, using "T." instead of "J.", but further down in the patent they use "J". Typographic or spelling errors like that can be found in many of the old patent listings. Some listings that I found say this torch was made by McGregor Adams Company in Chicago but those are probably wrong. Since the date it was made was after 1880 it was produced by Adams and Westlake Manufacturing Company. They started using the Adams and Westlake Manufacturing Company nmae in 1874.  Posted Saturday, March 23, 2013 by KM

 Q2525 Flashed Globe  Hi all, I recently purchased a 6 inch tall globe from one of our helpful Internet/Computer expert Railroadiana collectors. A very nice globe from the Intercolonial Railway, it is flashed red. But, upon closer examination, it is flashed on the OUTSIDE of the globe! It is not paint, or something less, it is actually part of the globe and does show wear and chipping on the edges, just as other flashed globes I own or have seen. But, I cannot recall ever seeing a globe that was flashed on the outside. In fact, from what I recall on the method of flashing, I cannot even guess how it was done from the outside. I did speak with the seller, and he had this particular globe for about 10 years and he thought some globes he has seen, were indeed outside flashed. So, there you have it and here is the question: Any other collectors out there know of or have a globe that was flashed on the exterior? If so, tell us about it, where did you find it, what railroad is embossed on it?? Maybe this is only a Canadian thing eh? Thanks.  Posted Tuesday, March 19, 2013 by Gary   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A.  Hi Gary, Take a look at Q2020 for some discussion on flashed globes. -- It's actually much easier to make "Flashed" glass with the color on the outside. When blowing glass, a thick glob of molten clear glass is gathered on the end of the blow pipe. That glob is then dipped into molten colored glass and a very thin layer of the colored glass is gathered as a coating on the outside of the thicker clear glass. Skilled craftsmen can achieve a very uniform layer of thin colored glass covering the clear glass in this process. This, two color, coated glob is then blown into the mould to create the finished globe. As a result, the colored glass is on the outside of the globe. Starting with a very thin glob of colored glass and then gathering a thicker layer of clear glass over that is very difficult as the thin colored glob would distort in the process of gathering the much thicker coating of clear glass. This would produce an uneven thickness of colored glass with thick and thin areas, with resulting in areas of more and less dense coloring around the globe; not at all uniform. Where the flashing is on the inside of the globe, the glass is generally gathered in the first manner, with the color on the outside, and then the glob is skillfully turned inside-out, and then blown into the mould; a much more difficult process. --- Some have postulated that Flashing is done by moulding the clear globe and then taking the finished clear globe and blowing a bubble of colored glass into it. I assure you, a process like that is impossible to achieve! The glob of glass blown into the mould has to have the two colors already fused together. ---- ....Red Beard. Posted Wednesday, March 20, 2013 by Red Beard the Railroad Raider

A. Hi Red Beard, Great explanation of the process. I would say that the other method of flashing a globe is spread about the hobby quite freely. I found it hard to believe that you could achieve any uniform coating of red, by blowing a bubble of red glass inside of an existing clear globe, but that is what the "experts" have always said. Your answer makes more sense and is more in line with how glass blowing is actually done! In question 2020, you gave a very good explanation of why flashing is preferred on the inside, less distortion of the flashed color, when exposed to the lettering, etc. That makes perfect sense to me, as the globe that I recently purchased, has thinner red on the exposed letters. Thanks for you excellent response to my question! Gary Posted Saturday, March 23, 2013 by GS

A. First I want to Thank Paul for making this site available for so many years. Next, flashed globes. (1) What is easier to fake is of no interest to me. (2) New England flashed globes have the red on the inside. I suspect rolled, they tend to not be balanced (3) I don't specialize in Canadian lanterns. (4) The flashed globes that I deal in are from pre-1898 so if somebody on this list thinks they know more/how they were made based on a current glass guy - more power to him. Regards - Feel free to contact me about who you might trust on Canadian lanterns - Scott Czaja Link 1  Posted Thursday, April 4, 2013 by scott czaja

 Q2520 Lantern/Lamp ID Needed  Can you please tell me what type of lanterns these are? They are around 20 inches tall. Thanks,   [Click on image for larger version.] Posted Wednesday, March 13, 2013 by Mike   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. This has been posted for 4 or 5 days with no replies so here are the questions. Is there a font or burner in these? If so is it marked with a brand name? Can you send in a photo of that? Where did they come from, an auction, a dealer and what area of the country? My thougts are they might be bridge lights, or they might be European, but that is only my own opinion without anything to back it up at the moment. At 20" tall they are larger than taillights that might have been used on horse drawn or early motorized vehicles.  Posted Sunday, March 17, 2013 by KM

A. No markings, they were bought in south eastern CT. I do have other pictures, not sure how to post them.  Posted Wednesday, March 20, 2013 by Mike

 Q2518 ATSF Lamp  I have a lamp marked A.T.&S.F.R.R. Also on the lid is marked LEFT. There is a brass plate marked A136. It has two openings where lenses would have been. One smaller hole on the lid about 5/8 inch diam. Any info would help a ton. Thanks,   [Click on image for larger version.] Posted Tuesday, March 12, 2013 by Dan   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. I’m thinking your Lamp is a very old Armspear or perhaps from its predecessor company, the “Railroad Signal Lamp and Lantern Company”; or a very early M.M. Buck lamp. Buck was the predecessor to Handlan. (Link 1 for MM Buck) You can tell by the shape of the cap that it is likely from one of those manufacturers. -- Does it say anything on the cap?? -- It may have been a Classification Lamp for an engine or a Marker Lamp, as used on cabooses. In that era (late 1800s, early 1900s) there were two lens markers and both markers and class lamps were marked “Left” or “Right”. It is a very fine historical piece. Take a look at Q1873 for a “Railroad Signal Lamp & Lantern” lamp. --- ....Red Beard  Link 1  Posted Wednesday, March 13, 2013 by Red Beard the Railroad Raider

A. Thanks Red Beard. No markings on what appears to be the galvanised lid. I can however see where another plate was, The Adams & Westlake Company is visible. Also on the inside it looks like square pieces of glass would have been held. Do you know what color the glass would have been? Is there any more info I can give you? What is the small hole for on the top? Sorry if my questions are dumb. I'm just very new at this. Found this one in a field.  Posted Wednesday, March 13, 2013 by Dan

A.  Thanks Dan, that helps. --Note; there are NO dumb questions!! All of us have to start somewhere, and none of us know everything; Clearly, as I missed the fact that your lamp is from Adlake! LOL --- Please SAY MORE about the 5/8 inch hole in the lid. Based on the photo of the whole lamp, where is it located?? I’m not sure what it would be for. --- It would be an Adams & Westlake "No 42 Engine Classification Lamp Lower Draught"; so it is a Classification Lamp. (See Link 1.) -- “Lower Draught” refers to the fresh air intake holes around the bottom of the lamp. This is a pre “Non Sweating Ventilation” design. (See Q2341, second answer) -- It would have had clear lenses (called 'White' in the catalogue.) To change the aspect color to Green, there would have been removable green glass slides that fit into the square frames. There should be a pocket inside the lamp to hold those green filters when they were not in use. Clear lenses come up for sale on eBay frequently. -- For green filters ; take the lamp body to a good stained glass shop and ask them to cut some green pieces to fit the space in the lamp. You want glass that is flat and has no pattern on the surface, a few bubbles or ‘seeds’ in the glass would be fine and typical of glass from that period --- As to COLOR; that is a very old lamp and likely pre-dated the adoption of the current teal-green color used in lamps that we see all the time in the collector hobby, known as “Signal Green”. Modern Signal Green was not adopted by the Railway Signal Association until 1908 and its universal use across the country wasn’t realized until 1914. -- (See Q1730) -- If it were my lamp, I would purposely avoid a Signal Green (Teal) color and choose a grass green or slightly yellow-green color and turn the color into a conversation starter, explaining to visitors how the lamp pre-dates the "Signal Green" color and how with 32 different shades of green having been used in lamps prior to 1908 (per Q1730), Signal Green would be an incorrect color filter for this lamp. Again, that is a very interesting piece and a good find! --- ....Red Beard  Link 1  Posted Thursday, March 14, 2013 by Red Beard the Railroad Raider

A. Hello Dan, I have an old class lamp about the same era as yours made by Adams and Westlake and as my peephole to monitor the flame is on the lid with the usual glass window and brass frame,my guess is that this is what that hole is for on your lamp,but the glass and little round frame has probably corroded off the lamp body years ago.As to the inside frame to hold the green glass color filters as Red suggests,some lamp mfrs made this frame with 4 slots of which 2 held the green filters when in use behind the clear lenses and the other 2 slots to hold them when not used and only displaying clear aspects.If this frame only has 2 slots then sometimes there are brass clips to hold them firmly in the back inside area of the lamp body and other times,there is an actual metal pocket soldered onto the outside rear of the lamp to hold the green filters.Usually the inside of this pocket will have a stiff flat brass spring clip that pushes against the filters so they don't bounce and rattle around,eventually breaking.Many of these very early class lamps had to have the filters moved manually,and yours is one of them.Later versions had the round filters actually clipped into mechanical arms that flipped up and down inside the lamp and were controlled on the outside of the lamp via brass toggles that were moved up and down with your fingers.There may be an earlier question in this site's files that show a picture of this automatic change feature but I haven't looked for one.Maybe this answered at least one of your questions and Red will add to it when he reads it.DJB Posted Thursday, March 14, 2013 by DJB

A. Hi guys, its Dan. Thanks again for the info. You guys are great! Another photo for you of my lamp. Again all info is greatly appreciated! Any idea of what A 136 means ?  Link 1  Posted Monday, March 18, 2013 by Dan

 Q2516 Lamp Information Needed  I have a lamp that looks just like the one on your website [see link to 'Cannonball Lamp'], except that it has 3 blue/green lenses and one red one. The round dome is cast iron rather than aluminum (I checked with a magnet.) The one I have is the bracket mount, not the flange mount. The word 'ADLAKE' is cast into the body just above one of the lenses, so it's clearly from the Adams & Westlake family. Mine does not have the 'blinder' so all 4 lenses are lit. This is how it was when I found it. I have just a few questions: 1) What is this properly called? 2) Where would this have been used? (On a caboose, on an engine, on a switch, etc?) 3) When would it have been made? Thanks.  Posted Saturday, March 9, 2013 by Jim  Link 1     Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. You have given a perfect description of the Marker light in the same Adlake series as the Classification Light you referenced. See the link for the page for Markers in the archives here on the site. 'Marker' or 'Rear End Marker' is the correct term. These were used on passenger trains and locomotive tenders because there was electricity available to light them, and the RR's decided it was worth setting up the necessary receptacles for the markers to plug in to. They were used less often on cabooses because cabooses received interior electrical wiring much later and kerosene remained very practical. The catalog page is from 1927; as with many of this type of lamp they were produced and used over quite a long time period. For example, the Nickel Plate Road passenger trains carried markers exactly like this until the passenger service ended in the mid-1960's.  Link 1  Posted Saturday, March 9, 2013 by RJMc

A. Thanks for your reply and the link. I just want to make sure I understand this correctly. Were these used in pairs on the rear corners of tenders and on the rear corners of the last car of a passenger train, or was there just one mounted more centrally? I'd love to be able to mount this on a wall bracket, so it could be seen and displayed. I've found brackets for sale for mounting the tapered wedge that these used. Are all these tapers the same, so that I don't have to worry about a mismatch? I found this one abandoned near the Monon Line around 1966, half buried in the ground. It came with a short cord and a 2 round pin plug and a 32 V light bulb with a standard Edison base. I've modified it to work on 120 V, but I still have the original plug, cord, and bulb, so it could be restored easily.  Posted Saturday, March 9, 2013 by Jim Adney

A.  Jim; What an amazing find! A few notes on electric markers; electric markers had some distinct advantages over kerosene lamps. They took almost no maintenance and railroads loved to save money on labor costs. They were also many times brighter than an oil burning lamp. Some railroads electrified their cabooses and used this type of lamps; the Union Pacific and the DM&IR among them. When I worked on the UP in the 1970s, after the end of markers, all of our cabooses were electrified, but we’d get C&NW steel cabooses all the time on run thru trains that were not electrified and still had Aladdin kerosene caboose lamps in them as the only source of light. Our crews hated them as they had wood floors and would hold the smell of spilled kerosene. Sometimes it was overpowering. We’d often hear arguments over the radio between the conductor trying to refuse the caboose and the dispatcher who was trying to get the train out of town. --- Motor cars or Doodle Bugs, self powered passenger cars used on branch lines, often used electrified markers too. On passenger cars, many lines used a single lens red lamp in the doorway of the last car. Where used, these were paired with two corner markers up until the last years of service. In the 1960s and until the end in 1971 the Union Pacific went to a single red electric light hung on the scissors gate in the end doorway of the last car and no corner markers. -- Electric markers like yours were used in pairs, one on each rear corner. -- On steam tenders, many roads had a permanently mounted, centered red light on the back end of the tender in addition to removable markers. Union Pacific’s centipede tenders used on the 800s, Challengers and Big Boys had a permanent red light mounted on top of the center of the tender and had removable electric markers as well. By the time markers were electrified, nobody cared about trying to pair matching markers on equipment. You would see Adlake lamps paired with Handlans and frequently a lamp like yours paired with an old kerosene marker that had been electrified; a lamp was a lamp. ---- As far as a mounting bracket; that wedge foot was a standardized item so all brackets SHOULD fit, I say “should” as there are many reproduction brackets out there that are cast in aluminum, and aluminum shrinks a few percent as it cools from a liquid to a solid. These reproduction brackets are most always made from a mould taken from an original iron bracket. As a result, the reproductions are a little undersized and some are too tight to accept that wedge foot. If you end up with one of these, you can usually take a flat file and remove enough material to open the bracket to where it will be useable. The wedge is tapered, so that’s not the problem; rather it is that the bracket is too tight front to back to accept the thickness of the wedge. This will take a little time, but will yield a useable bracket. ---- ....Red Beard. Posted Sunday, March 10, 2013 by Red Beard the Railroad Raider

A. For more info see prior Q's 1464 and 1148. Markers such as yours were used in pairs on the rear corners of the passenger car, tender, or caboose. The usual requirement was "one is sufficient, but two are required." The 32 volt bulbs with standard screw-type bases were used on almost all steam locomotive and tender lighting, but also on many passenger cars (even up thru the 'Heritage' cars used extensively by Amtrak), and a two-prong plug was also typical for any of these applications. The marker mounts might have been on the side of the car, at 45 degrees on the end of the car, or even on the flat back face of the car. So the body of the marker could be turned compared to the bracket, for two reasons: originally the marker had to be rotated to show green (at least, other than red) to the rear when the train was clear of the main line in a siding, then back to red when the train went back out onto the main line. This prevented an overtaking train from mistaking the red for an emergency stop warning -- which it was when the train was on the main line. The marker body also needed to turn to accommodate the differing bracket positions, to make sure the red could/would always show to the rear as a marker. The mounting positions allowing one of the greens to show to the front (say on the corner) was preferred; that way the engine crew could look back and make sure the markers were in place, lit, and properly displayed -- reassuring them they had the whole train with them and nothing had been lost along the way, which would create a hazard for following trains. Although lit markers are required today more than ever -- now by Federal law as well as by RR rules -- the functions other than just warning a following train have been taken over by radios and signal systems, so now there is usually just one red or yellow light on the back lit the same way at all times.  Posted Sunday, March 10, 2013 by RJMc

A. Thanks to everyone for your replies and all the information about how my Marker Lamp would have been used. Q1464 was interesting because my college roommate and I actually found 2 lanterns at the same time. He kept the older one, which resembles those in this question. I'll have to contact him to see if he still has it and if has an Adlake marking. I don't remember now, but I assume it was a kerosene lantern. One question still unanswered about mine is the fact that mine is cast iron throughout. The 1927 Adlake catalog lantern is cast aluminum. From the dates mentioned in Q1464 it would appear that the cast iron version must have been made for only a short time between 1922 and 1927. Can anyone shed a bit more light on this? Posted Tuesday, March 12, 2013 by Jim Adney

 Q2514 ATSF Lamp Info Needed  I need help in identifying the manufacturer of a switch/marker lamp marked C (or G) L 31 X made for the Atchison Topeka and Santa Fe. It appears to be Adams & Westlake with the earliest Patent Date 1901. There is a number plate stamped S 48090. Would like to know the exact type and use and how to date it accurately. Thanks for your time and attention.   [Click on image for larger version.] Posted Wednesday, March 6, 2013 by MH   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. This appears to be an Adams and Westlake model MA-70 marker lamp for the AT&SF. I'm going out on a limb here, but my best guess is it is no longer in it's original configuration. The MA-70 came equipped with on large red lens (not sure exact size, but at least 5-3/8") and 3 ambers in the 4-1/2" range. Mine has an adapter that allows the larger lens to be mounted in one of the lamp body openings that are the same size as those holding the amber lenses. The fount would have fit into the bottom of the lamp, but appears your's has been electrified, which probably entailed the fount being removed or modified. Exact dating of these is difficult, as they were produced unchanged over the course of many years. Posted Wednesday, March 6, 2013 by JPN

A. MH; where on the lamp is it marked "CL31X"? --- JPN, Do you have any additional information on the MA-70 model number or catalogs it was listed in? I have been trying to track down information on these and the AT&SF switch lamps of the same design. ---- These marker lamps are made out of the same body as the Santa Fe fork mount switch lamps by attaching a marker lamp bracket ring to the base and the adaptor for the larger 5 3/8 in. red lens that JPN mentions. The electric conversion is homemade and post railroad service as Adlake made a very slick electric conversion unit for these lamps, which clipped into the bottom of the lamp, just like the original fuel pots did. The lenses sizes in these bodies were 4-1/2 inch and 4-1/8 inch. On a Switch Lamp, Yellow was 4-1/2 and Green was 4-1/8. On the Marker Lamps the 5-3/8 conversion collar for the red lens went on one of the 4-1/2 inch openings with the other 4-1/2 and both 4-1/8 lenses in yellow. --- In this hobby never say “Never” or “Always”; having said that I offer the following. --- Note that the bases on these lamps that have the raised letters “SANTA FE” are cast brass. Surprisingly, the bases I’ve seen on both Switch Lamps and Markers are the same and all have had the eight indexing holes. (that doesn’t mean that all switch lamp bases had the indexing holes -- Can anyone add information on this ??? ) The body can be made into a Switch Lamp by attaching the ring that has the two fork mount tubes; or it can be made into a Marker Lamp by attaching the Marker Lamp Bracket ring and the large lens adaptor. -- So far; all Switch Lamps I’ve seen have the serial number tag on them with the number starting with the letter “S”. Some Marker Lamps have the “S” serial number tag on them, most do not. [see; Q1392 for Switch Lamp photo] This leads me to believe that Marker Lamps came without the serial number tag and some Switch Lamps were converted into markers; possibly to meet the demand for more equipment during the Second World War when the AT&SF was rapidly converting old box cars into their unique side door “Suicide” cabooses. (which were notoriously dangerous to get on and off of.) --- ....Red Beard Posted Thursday, March 7, 2013 by Red Beard the Railroad Raider

A. Red Beard, or anyone else. It seems that I've ever only seen this particular Adlake lamp with AT&SF markings. Did any other lines buy these? I've often wondered if the reason was the remote nature of the Santa Fe line and maybe the larger fuel fonts served the purpose of the lamps going longer between servicing and refueling. Any thoughts or knowledge on this? te Posted Thursday, March 7, 2013 by TE

A. For Red Beard: I don’t know that I’ve ever seen this style of Adlake lamp that wasn’t marked AT&SF. What’s up with that? I know that they had a larger than normal fuel font and I have often wondered if it was the nature of the terrain that the Santa Fe ran through in that they didn’t want to have to service the lamps as often as a less remote part of the country. But that is my whimsical thought only. I’ve never heard that from anyone else. Your views? Posted Thursday, March 7, 2013 by TE

A. Red Beard, my mistake on the number; that was the identifier Barrett's used for this lamp. I guess I've never seen one in the switch lamp configuration without the fork tubes in it; the indexing holes are what led me to believe it to be a marker. I do believe these were exclusively made for the AT&SF, which is why they never appeared in an Adlake catalog. Makes sense if they weren't a line item they were trying to sell. Barrett also mentions them not being in any catalogs as well. Are you sure the Santa Fe was a tag? I striped and repainted mine, and I seem to remember mine was embossed or cast (I think the base was a seperate casting than the stamped steel body), not soldered on. Jim Posted Friday, March 8, 2013 by JPN

A.  Hey guys! Thanks for the questions. --- NOTE; there is a long discussion on these lamps in Q1392 --- The bases are CAST ALUMINUM, and the raised letters on the cast base, either “SANTA FE” or “AT&SFRy”, are in fact cast into the base, and with the two different wordings. There are also some variations in the appearance of the letters, and on some, “SANTA FE” has a raised outline box around the letters; so that’s at least four variations of the bases just based on lettering. The “Tag” I mention has the serial number stamped on it (not Santa Fe) and these are riveted onto the body above and between the lenses. The bases have four ears or tabs that stick up a bit and it’s those ears, through which the rivets pass, that hold the aluminum base to the steel lamp body. There are also two variations of “ears”; rounded and square. The rounded ears (such as the lamp in this question has) take one rivet each and the square ears take two rivets each; so there’s another variation. There are at least two slight variations in bodies as well; on one, the lenses sit about 1/4 inch farther out from the body than on the other. If you see photos of the two body styles, the difference is immediately noticeable. -- These exact lamps, with the top and bottom body halves riveted together, are unique to the Santa Fe (or were they??? ..see D&RGW ref. below!); however, they are a slight variation of the No. 63 Adlake lamp (Link 1), a very early design from the early 1900s. No. 63 lamps had the top and bottom body halves held together with screws as the body had to be split in half to replace the lenses. (see first answer to Q1392 for details) The No. 63 lamp was used by many roads and some, but very few, survived into the 1970s. Careful study of old photos in many books show these No. 63 lamps in use, though very few are shown in photos past the 1930s. The No. 63 was a fork mount lamp and most I’ve seen had a small fuel font, the bottom of which was flush with the bottom of the lamp. They sat on a fork mount with shorter fork legs than the Santa Fe lamps. The fork for the Santa Fe lamps has longer legs, as do the Great Northern, Northern Pacific and Western Pacific ones. On the Santa Fe, the longer fork allows for the use of the longer fuel font sticking out of the bottom of the lamp. --- It’s hard to talk dealers into letting you dismantle a lamp at a show, so I haven’t been able to take that fork tube assembly off any switch lamps to find out if many, other than the few I have seen taken apart, have the eight holes going around the base. The lamp in this question may well have been a Marker Lamp, and could have been a Switch Lamp. The serial number tag with the “S” on it makes me think it was actually a Switch Lamp. -- TE; what you suggest about the large oil pot makes sense to me. Last fall I did a little tour around Colorado and had two interesting encounters; some ardent D&RGW fans showed me some 1930s era photos of a narrow gauge yard full of what looked just the AT&SF lamps, even with the extra long oil pot sticking out of the bottom of the lamps!! They also certainly could have been standard Adlake No. 63 lamps with the over sized oil pot. Encounter #2 was getting to talk with a knowledgeable railroadiana dealer in Denver who believed the Santa Fe made the switch and marker lamps themselves!! ..hmmm; I certainly have never seen Handlan or Dressel lamps marked for the Santa Fe and can find no photos of such in service on the Santa Fe. Santa Fe did have some WRRS model 1870 electric switch lamps. You can spot the #1870 lamps as they are the ones where the lenses are held on with a large washer like flat ring with four screws going through the ring holding the ring to the lamp with the edge of the lens between the ring and the lamp body. --- The Adlake No. 63 lamp was an obsolete design by the 1920s, yet the near identical Santa Fe lamps were found universally and exclusively around the system until the end of Marker and Switch Lamp usage in the 1970s. The Santa Fe even had an electrified version of the standard Marker Lamp where the smoke cone and the portion with the vent holes below the cone were taken off and a round metal plate was welded on to close off the top of the lamp. --- There are very, very few of the Santa Fe lamps with “Adlake” caps and / or the patent date tags. That combined with the fact that the Santa Fe used ONLY this style of lamp, combined with the fact that they were based on an obsolete design, yet used until the end of kerosene lamps in the ‘70s, makes me wonder if the Santa Fe obtained the dies and rights to manufacture these lamps from Adlake and in fact did make the lamps themselves... Any ideas from anybody ??? ..always fun to chat with you guys! --- ....Red Beard. © 2013 Red Beard the Railroad Raider.  Link 1  Posted Saturday, March 9, 2013 by Red Beard the Railroad Raider

A. Your theory about the Santa Fe actually acquiring the dies and jigs to make these special lamps does make sense.I always wondered if the plain flat top versions were older or newer than the stamped A&W tops and I am beginning to believe the plain tops were the newer version and my reasoning is that if A&W sold the production rights and dies,they sure wouldn't want their trademarks used any longer,plus the fact that those top dies must have been very expensive to make with all the wording on them,and they still needed them for other lamp production.About the extra capacity founts on the Santa Fe lamps,you nailed it about having get out to the remote lamp locations and fill them,esp since the usual founts would have to be filled twice a week,rather than once with the large founts.This was the main complaint from the section forces that I talked with when I was still employed by a well known midwest railroad.About the fork length,our line cut off/shortened nearly all the forks in order to prevent the founts from actually falling out and dropping.These old #63 lamps were used yet in large numbers even up to their retirement in the early seventies,but mostly on the secondary lines.The main lines seemed to have been upgraded to lamp models with the large 31 ounce founts,for reasons I mentioned earlier.DJB Posted Saturday, March 9, 2013 by DJB

A.  DJB, ..take a look at the first answer to Q1392. Regarding the No. 63 lamps you saw in service; does my description of them needing to be split in half to replace a lens fit with what you remember, or did the lenses attach with a coupling ring as on the Santa Fe lamps??? That is very interesting that there were so many of them still in service that late. Different roads had such varying practices as to what they purchased and what they held onto or replaced. I know from old photos that the UP had No. 63 lamps, but I never saw any in service in the 1960s and ‘70s. The UP and the SP both had a liking for the No. 169 lamp; Round Top, Round Base, Fork Mount (Link 1), again a very early design; being listed in the 1907 catalog. The 169’s were truly ubiquitous, being found everywhere on the UP system, almost completely to the exclusion of anything else. There were a few Adlake #1112 Square Top lamps with Round Base and Fork Mount Tubes, though not that many. I’ve never seen a Handlan Switch Lamp on the UP, nor one marked UP for sale; though they did use Handlan electric Markers and Class Lamps. The UP did have a very, very few Dressel Switch Lamps; far fewer than the Square Top Adlakes. --- Where am I going with all of this? ..Some railroads liked a particular make and model of Switch Lamp enough to standardize them system wide, pretty much to the exclusion of anything else, as did the AT&SF with the lamps we are talking about. The G.N. lamps were unique with a top opening cylindrical body Adlake and internal Fork Mount Tubes. ...I have long suspected that Adlake continued to make the Round Top 169 lamps for the UP well past the introduction of the newer Square Top lamps which were introduced in the mid 1920s. There were simply too many Round Top lamps in proportion to the few Square Tops at the end when the UP held that famous sale at the Omaha Annex building in the early 1970s, where they gathered all remaining kerosene lamps and lanterns system wide and sold them in large lots at $5 each, ..yup, five bucks per lamp or lantern!! --- ....Red Beard.  Link 1  Posted Saturday, March 9, 2013 by Red Beard the Railroad Raider

A. Hello Red,in answering your question about the #63 lamps we used,they were the standard model with 2 piece body with a 3/8 inch groove to hold the lense and molded rubber gasket.They also had those 2 piece cast iron corner plates and the 1/4 inch bolts had square nuts to boot.A lot of those lamps were in service to the bitter end.The Ashland line seemed to have the most in use followed by a lot of them used in yard service where it was more convenient to fill them twice a week.One must remember that vandalism wasn't so rampant back then and lenses didn't need replacing as often,but there seemed to be a lot of damage from hunters using them for targets.More than one lamp had a piece of cotton rag wrapped around a farmer's match and stuffed into a bullet hole to keep the wind out and that's no story.If one studies the way the pinch-type oil founts were constructed,and all the pieces and parts needed to assemble them,its no wonder they didn't stay in production as long as other models.I will bet the replacement founts got somewhat expensive toward the end of use? If the readers take a really close look at the bolt-on forks made by A&W,and they are not painted too many times,one can often see the shallow cast-down-in letters of the owning railroad.I have seen many of these forks lightly cast-in with WCL,which of course was Wis Central Lines.They will also have a single set screw with a square head and a cast raised number which I believe is the tip casting pattern number that it would fit in use? Maybe this will shed a little more light on these marvelous old soldiers? DJB Posted Saturday, March 9, 2013 by DJB

A. DJB; Speaking of people shooting out switch lamps; Back in the early ‘70s, before I hired out on the UP, the Milwaukee had an incident in Council Bluffs. I don’t know if they were shooting at switch lamps or actually at the crew, but somebody was shooting at something while the crews were out switching cars. Railroads have always been vigilant about attacks on employees. The Milwaukee pulled in a dozen or so Special Agents from across the road and had them out switching cars while wearing highly visible side arms for a few weeks. That seemed to solve the problem. The crews must have loved that as being a protected craft, they got to stay home and still turn in a time card for the hours the Bulls were switching! ---- ....Red Beard Posted Sunday, March 10, 2013 by Red Beard the Railroad Raider

A. I have a set of this style of marker lamps. It is electrified with a spring loaded base that fits into the bottom of the lamp. Were they originally painted black or silver? the set I have is silver but doesn't look like it is the original paint.  Posted Tuesday, March 8, 2016 by Red Beard

 Q2510 Use of Torches  What exactly were torches used for? I have read they were used to light switch lamps, start fires in fireboxes. Can't imagine they were used for light in an industry were lanterns were everywhere. Any difference in use in the versions with the long tubular handles?  Posted Sunday, February 24, 2013 by SB   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. Not usually for the uses you mentioned. More for checking for leaks on steam locomotives. Leaking air or steam would affect the torch flame and help isolate the location of the leak(s). You certainly don't want check for steam leaks with a bare hand. Also came in handy for thawing frozen valves and pipes in the winter, although a blow torch would be more effective there. I'm sure more uses will be revealed by other who have actually used them. Posted Sunday, February 24, 2013 by JFR

A. Torches were used for various things, checking for air leaks (you could generally see a steam leak), heating thick lubricants,etc. And of course I always light my cigar with it before I blow the torch out and start my day! JN Posted Monday, February 25, 2013 by JN

A. Well, we have talked a lot about torches on this site in the past....the above answers are correct; a live steam locomotive is ALWAYS making various noises (examples blowers, turbine generators, injectors, air pumps), and the locomotive is often housed in a roundhouse where all kinds of things are making noise, so the torch is essential to detect leaks, particularly of air from the brake system. For further info enter these prior Q numbers in the 'By Question Number Box' to see the discussion: 2209, 2027, 1870, 1698, 1280, 1165, 567, 37 (and I'm sure we still missed some.)  Posted Monday, February 25, 2013 by RJMc

A. An even better reference is the New York Central 1940's film "The Steam Locomotive" available on YouTube (see link.) In a sequence showing and describing roundhouse maintenance procedures, at 10 to 11 minutes in the 18-minute film, torches are shown in use both inside and outside engines and the narrator says "A flaming torch serves a double purpose; ....giving light, and detecting air leaks...". The film primarily features NYC's Hudsons, but the procedures they show still apply to steam engines operating in excrusion service today.  Link 1  Posted Monday, February 25, 2013 by RJMc

 Q2506 Lantern/Lamp ID Needed  Can anyone ID this railroad lantern? I don't believe it has any markings [although it has a Handlan manufacturer's mark - not shown]. Believe it came from Great Northern RR.   [Click on image for larger version.] Posted Sunday, February 17, 2013 by RS   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A.  Is this a kerosene lamp or electric? Does anyone know what a Handlan "Electric Post Lamp" looked like? See the link for page 12 "Handlan Specialties" from the 1956 Handlan catalog which is posted in the Railroadiana Online library. My other thought is it might be a collection of pieces and parts that someone put together. Is there any spring loaded globe retainer in the top? If not than those threaded rods might put a lot of pressure on that globe and break it. Link 1  Posted Monday, February 18, 2013 by KM

 Q2504 Authentic Caboose Lantern?  I have been collecting railroad lanterns for some time now. Recently, I came across this lantern on ebay. Is it an authentic railroad caboose lantern? It doesn't have any manufacturer name on it like Adlake, etc. Based on your opinion from looking at the attached photo, is it authentic or fake? Thanks,   [Click on image for larger version.] Posted Sunday, February 17, 2013 by JH   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. Is the burner or the wick adjusting knob also unmarked? If they are made by P&A, (Plume and Atwood) you might be able to date them. Try posting this question on The Lampguild Q&A, www.lamguild.org. Some of thee regulars there may recognize pieces or parts of this lamp.  Posted Monday, February 18, 2013 by KM

 Q2503 Reproduction Two-Color Globes  Have there been any recent reports of reproduction two color globes hitting the market? I just won a D&H tall globe Dressel in an online auction that has a clear over green two color D&H script globe. Globe appears correct with strong crisp casting and Corning Nonex hallmark. Top rim has fleabite chips indicating that it has seen use. What triggered my radar was that bidding was not as heavy as I would have expected for a two color globe. I have not yet received lantern so impossible for me to judge.  Posted Thursday, February 7, 2013 by JW   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. Better link Link 1  Posted Friday, February 8, 2013 by DA

A. Link still didn't work. Field size needs to be increased. Posted Friday, February 8, 2013 by JW

A. The following note at the bottom of the listing probably explains this "situation"............ "Note: The blue color on the lower part of the globe appears to be a plastic overlay or paint that may be removable, but its is not blue glass. " Was this posted before you bid on it??? Link 1  Posted Friday, February 8, 2013 by DA

A. Well, apparently, the idiots at Ebay won't let you link to an item that has been sold...... Here is the item number if you want to take a look at it..... 221184119377  Posted Friday, February 8, 2013 by DA

A. Yeah, I only saw that note after the auction had ended. The Seller posted that after I had placed my bid. I never went back to read the listing again. I contacted the Seller and will return the lantern. Thanks for your help. P.S. I tried to post the link again; the "link" field on the Railroadiana.org answer page was too short so I dropped the "http". Link 1  Posted Friday, February 8, 2013 by JW

A. There is nothing wrong with non period two color globes for display as long as it is so stated. What makes it wrong or fake is when a seller tries to pass it off as a original, period authentic or just doesn't know.  Posted Friday, February 15, 2013 by Keith

 Q2501 #300 fount  I recently purchased a Boston & Maine Adams and Westlake Adlake Reliable lantern. The last patent date is 1913. It has a perfectly functioning #300 fount. However upon closer inspection the fount has some cotton looking material inside it. This peaked my curiosity. I have dome some digging around online and cannot find any pictures of a fount with this material in it. The replacement founts all seem completely empty. Can I use my lantern with this material? Should I attempt to remove it? Should I just get a replacement fount and keep this one original? Thanks for any input.  Posted Sunday, February 3, 2013 by Jay   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. The font can be used with or without the cotton packing in it. It keeps the oil from splashing around inside. Some people prefer to take it out, as it can trap moisture and corrode the font from the inside. New fonts come without the packing. It is all a matter of personal choice. Posted Sunday, February 3, 2013 by JN

A. I STRONGLY suggest leaving it in there!!!! - Unfortunately there are a number of trendy ideas in this hobby that are very short sighted. Founts with the original batting in them are becoming increasingly rare as more and more uninformed novice collectors pull the material out of the pot; often as a result of poor advice from some contributors on this site. Even though collectors today are oblivious to the value of that original batting in the pot, I believe pots with original material in them will be highly sought after in decades to come, as so few of them can be found. --- For collector / hobby use, the batting will not cause ANY problems with moisture collection. --- Rinse the pot out several times with a quality alcohol based fuel drier like HEET and let it thoroughly dry outside in the hot sun for a few days. Wash the wick out in alcohol too. That will get any water out of the pot and batting. The little bit of use you will put it to over the years will not create any significant moisture build up in the pot that would cause rusting; and you will be saving a valuable piece of history for future generations of collectors. --- ....Red Beard Posted Monday, February 4, 2013 by Red Beard the Railroad Raider

A. The wick will take moisture from the air and "wick" the moisture into the pot. This moisture can then rust the pot. If you have kerosene or lamp oil in the pot, the moisture shouldn't be a problem. Posted Monday, February 4, 2013 by Gary

A. I would highly reccomend what Raider stated. Many times this cotton batting smells from the old high sulphur kerosene. A good rinsing with a hydrocarbon solvent such as toluene,benzene or naphta will clean out the old kerosene. Then rinse with lacquer thinner or acetone as these solvents contain no added water either in manufacturing or in their chemical formula.This will eliminate any formation of rusting. But, be very careful when using, as these solvents are "highly flamable". Posted Sunday, February 17, 2013 by Keitth Kalkanoff

 Q2500 Vaclite Lantern  What is a Vaclite Lantern and how was it used?? Thank you.  Posted Sunday, February 3, 2013 by Keith   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. See Question 2500 on this site Posted Monday, February 4, 2013 by BK

A. See Q774 in the Archives. Vaclite was a subsidiary of Satndard Oil Company. They had other lantern manufacturers produce lanterns for them. The Vaclite lantern that I have is identical to a Rayo 39WB, and both of them may have been produced by Perkins Marine Lamp Co.I am fairly certain that my 39WB was used on the PRR, because it has a marked globe in it. MY Vaclite may have seen railroad use but it is not marked for it. It also may have been sold by a hardware store for general use.  Posted Monday, February 4, 2013 by KM

A. Vaclite lanterns used a semi-solid fuel similar to a wax or grease that was produced by the Vacuum Oil Company. They were used by the US Navy and other ships because there was less risk of spillage due to the thicker fuel. They required a Minot style burner that had wire rods that looped above the flame and then down into the fuel to melt it. My Vaclite does not have the Minot burner in it so it may have been converted at some point for use with kerosene. The patent date on mine is 1/21/13. That information is from "Lanterns That Lit Our World,Book Two" by Anthony Hobson pages 94 and 95. Posted Monday, February 4, 2013 by KM

A. Here is the link for patent number 1,050,913 from Google Patent Search. Link 1  Posted Monday, February 4, 2013 by KM

A. This link has some photos of a Vaclite lantern that was sold recenty. They show the Minot style burner with the wire loops that go above the flame and wick tube. My lantern has the correct burner but it is missing the wires. I have been trying to remove the burner from the font without success, does anyone now if it is threaded in, or just a tight fit?  Link 1  Posted Tuesday, February 5, 2013 by KM

A. Sorry, the link is broken, if you want to see the photos search Vaclite and check out the posting from Prices For Antiques.  Posted Tuesday, February 5, 2013 by KM

 Q2497 Lamp Info Needed  Picked this up today, just because it was so klunky and odd. I'm thinking it is a RR Lantern of some kind. Large red globular lens with two small clear ones on each side. Big side panel slides up to access a tank and round rope type wick. No markings I can find. Overall height is 19 inches. Tank inside is embossed on top 'The Adams & Westlake Company' 'New York – Philadelphia – Chicago.' Also 'Use Kerosene Oil Only.' No markings on bottom, just four raised round legs to keep it on the bottom of the lantern. Unfortunately the burner is missing. Needs a good stiff cleaning, covered with soot. Any thoughts appreciated! Would love to get it going! Best regards!   [Click on image for larger version.] Posted Saturday, January 26, 2013 by Mike   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. It is a crossing gate lamp. Posted Sunday, January 27, 2013 by JFR

A. This type of lamp was used at highway grade crossings. It might have hung directly on the pole holding the crossbuck signs, or on a crossing gate lowered across the road. The red light warned the highway traffic; the small white side lights showed approaching trains and/or the crossing watchman that the warning was working. The shield around the red lens prevented the train from mistaking the highway-side warning for a stop signal. The spring handle arrangement is kind of unusual and looks home made. The link is to the archives elsewhere on this site, where vintage catalogs are reproduced which show the multiple types of lamps Adlake produced from the same basic design, over many decades, for a wide variety of purposes.  Link 1  Posted Sunday, January 27, 2013 by RJMc

A. The link below is to a 1940 Encyclopedia Britannica 10-minute educational video available on YouTube showing a trip on a B&O passenger train. Beginning at 4:25 into the film, the train is shown passing a grade crossing with a good view of a lamp very similar to yours hung on the crossbuck pole.  Link 1  Posted Sunday, January 27, 2013 by RJMc

A. Hello Mike,I agree so far with what the others have told you about your lamp and am going to add a couple comments.That strange coiled handle is made like it is for the purpose of its not getting hot while sitting lit between uses.Its the same principal as the coiled handle grip on a fireplace log poker or the handle used on the old cast iron cook stoves to remove the lids to add wood.The coils dissipate and radiate the heat before it can burn a bare hand.The last comment to be made is that if you disassemble the top handle and holder assembly and remove it from the lamp ventilator cap,I can almost certainly tell you the the lamp cap underneath will read DRESSEL COMPANY in embossed letters.This is the original mfr and I can tell by the general shape of the vent assembly.It won't hurt to remove it and do a good cleaning and repainting before putting the handle assembly back on the lamp.Give it a try and let me know what you discover.DJB Posted Tuesday, January 29, 2013 by DJB

A. Thanks Gentlemen! Makes for a most interesting lamp. Looking forward to 'reviving' it. DJB - You are entirely correct. The handle was easily removed...., although the soot :-0 and beneath it is "DRESSEL" and in a circle around it is "ARLINGTON NJ USA." Do you think the hood on the lens is original? Can't wait to get going on it! - Best regards! Mike Posted Tuesday, January 29, 2013 by MAS

A. A slight difference of opinion, if I may. The previous handle explanation is logical but, I believe the "spring" handle was a shock absorbing mechanism so when gate was raised/lowered, the shock of the gate reaching it's limits was softened and had less chance of extinguishing the flame in the lamp. That could be why you rarely, if ever see this arrangement on other lamps. Posted Wednesday, January 30, 2013 by JFR

A. In don't see how this type of handle was ever designed to ride up and down on a crossing gate arm.At the very least,there would have to be some provision to always center the lamp in an upright position regardless of the angle of the gate.I also don't see any design feature that would keep the oil fount and burner from tipping or falling out during a gate cycle.That lamp was designed to be carried by a gateman.Mike,you asked about the long hood over the lense.The explanation about shielding the red light against an oncoming train taking it as a stop signal,is correct.Maybe Red Beard has a take on this crossing lamp and could grace us with his wisdom ??? DJB Posted Wednesday, January 30, 2013 by DJB

A.  That odd looking clamp that holds the coiled handle to the cap is Original Equipment and all three major manufacturers (Adlake, Dressel & Handlan) made lamps with this style of cap clamp coiled handle. It is intended as a handle and not as a “spring”, as the lamp is not heavy enough to flex a coil that stout. ---- A replacement burner can be found on eBay as they come up often. All brands are interchangeable. -- Mike; Your lamp is a Dressel model No. 1499 and was listed in the 1926 Dressel catalog. -- In David Dreimiller’s reprint of that catalog {Hiram Press, © 1995} he comments on Dressel Bulletin CL-250; Crossing Gate Lamps (stating in Dreimiller’s own words, not Dressel’s): “Crossing Gate Lamps were designed to ride up and down on the gate arms at highway crossings. Dressel long relied on its line of light-duty square body signal lamps for this type of service. However Dressel also produced cylindrical body gate lamps such as the No. 1499, which was built to A.R.A. specifications. Lamps of this type can be readily identified by a coiled carrying handle, which doubled as a mounting attachment.” --- This surprised me! --- I had always believed, through reading and photos, that the coil handle lamps were hand held by the Crossing Guard at night, as was the round “STOP” sign used in the daytime. However; never say never, with so many crossings and so many lamps, who knows what someone may have used one for. --- I had always thought that Lamps meant to be hung up had a wire bail with a single, full 360°, closed loop about an inch in diameter bent into the top center of the wire bail (handle) with the closed loop on top of the normal arch of the bail; that way it allowed the lamp to be picked up and carried (but not held for a long period of time) and also be hung up on a peg or hook in such a way as to limit its sliding and twisting movement once hung up. [Bails like this were used on bridge lamps, especially lift span bridges such as the rolling Bascule Bridge. This allowed the lamp to swing freely and rotate around the mounting peg or hook and thus remain plumb vertical from gravity as the lift section of the bridge swung up and down.] In Railroad use, this style of handle thus allowed the lamp to stay plumb vertical as a crossing gate was raised and lowered. The “light-duty square body signal lamps” Dreimiller mentions above had this style of bail with the closed loop at the top. --- A standard wire bail is fine for continuous handling of a light weight item such as a switchman’s hand lantern, but trying to hold, or repeatedly handle, a heavy lensed lamp by the typical bail found on a Switch Lamp is awkward and uncomfortable as the sharp curve of the bail and the thinness of the single wire press painfully into your hand, even when wearing heavy gloves. Although, the traditional single loop wire bail used on Switch Lamps would suffice for normal handling during maintenance on these Crossing Lamps. (and they would require no more servicing than a switch lamp) -- The only reason I can think of for the coiled handle would be for continuous handling by the Crossing Guard throughout his shift as a hand held lamp. -- Could the coil handle have served a dual purpose, manual handling and hanging? ...Certainly. ------- Now a little on Crossing Guards: I think it is impossible for readers today to fully appreciate how many people worked for the railroads in their heyday; likely several percent of the total working population. Everyone knew several people who worked on the railroad, so numerous were their ranks. In a time before automated electric crossing gates and flashing lights, busy crossings had one or more men on duty to signal and stop traffic, both horse drawn and auto, when a train was approaching. - There were manned crossings into the early 1970s - These crossings would have a shanty with a stove to shelter the Crossing Guards. In good photos of these shanties, you can often spot the hand held STOP sign and a lantern or two sitting outside the shanty, ready to be picked up when a train approached. OF INTEREST; there will often be a CRUTCH leaning against the shanty wall as well! --Why a Crutch?-- Debilitating injuries were common on the railroad. Being a switchman or brakeman were at one time the most dangerous jobs in America, largely due to the requirement of having to climb on and ride moving cars in all kinds of weather conditions, especially at night. One of the most common disabling injuries was slipping and having a foot or leg being crushed under the wheels of a moving car! These men were first in line for Crossing Guard jobs at less busy crossings. -- A while back on eBay I saw an antique toy lead figure of a peg-leged Crossing Guard, dressed in traditional railroad garb and holding a typical round yellow STOP sign. So common a sight were these amputee Crossing Guards that even toy manufacturers considered a one-leged man to be the typical representation of a Crossing Guard! --- ....Red Beard; © 2013, Red Beard the Railroad Raider.  Posted Thursday, January 31, 2013 by Red Beard the Railroad Raider

A. By The Way -- The 1926 catalog states that those lamps came with either a #99 round wick long time burner OR a #0 burner for a 1/2 inch flat wick. ..Red Beard Posted Thursday, January 31, 2013 by Red Beard the Railroad Raider

A. one more; that long hood is identical to the one pictured in the catalog. ..Red Beard Posted Thursday, January 31, 2013 by Red Beard the Railroad Raider

A. I'll take another shot at clearing this up. A railroad lamp is attached to something, like a crossing gate, switchstand, etc. A railroad lantern is portable, hand held signaling and lighting device. (Yes, sometimes things were pressed into other duty). A crossing guard almost always have used a STOP sign on a pole or paddle during the day and sometimes just a red flag. At night, a red hand lantern or red hand lantern with blinders would be used, or often just a fusee. I'm sure any watchman given a choice of lugging around a heavy lamp or lighter lantern is going with the lantern, regardless of the handle on the lamp. That spring handle allowed the lamp to be mounted to the gate so with ideal tension on the spring, the lamp would still pivot to stay plumb during use yet not swing about too wildly. This lessened the chance of broken roundels,chimneys,(if so equipped), and extinguished flames. Hoping this helps. Posted Thursday, January 31, 2013 by JFR

A. This question was originally posted on The Lampguild Q&A and someone has kindly scanned the Dressel 1926 catalog page in. See the link for Lampguild Q6375. Link 1  Posted Thursday, January 31, 2013 by KM

A. Concerning the lamp: I have one also but the handle is not coiled, it had a clear lens and it was used in the semaphore signals and as the blade passed by the lens it would display a different color. The one I had was used at an interlocking plant in Indiana. Posted Saturday, March 16, 2013 by Mitch

 Q2496 Q2462 Photo: GTR Lamp/Lantern  Here is a photo for Q2462. Does anyone have any idea as to the approximate timeline of manufacture/sale of this lantern and the manufacturer(s)? Thanks, in advance, for any assistance that the readers can provide. -- same question. Thanks for everything!   [Click on image for larger version.] Posted Saturday, January 26, 2013 by DG   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. Your lantern, or handlamp, is identical to one shown in a Piper's catalogue of the 1920's. I have two similar examples, the only difference being that mine have small oval plates fixed to the front of the reducing cone, one embossed GTR and the other CPR.  Posted Sunday, January 27, 2013 by JAJ

 Q2495 Chicago South Shore and South Bend RR  Did the Chicago South Shore and South Bend Railroad {CSS & SB RR) ever use oil fired railroad lanterns? I have been checking and cannot find them even in collections. Thank you.  Posted Monday, January 21, 2013 by KTK   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. The Lantern Surveys do not show any lanterns or globes marked CSS&SB either. But, I have two Dietz Acme Inspector lamps which came from a South Shore garage sale. I bought them on eBay and the seller sent the railroad bill of sale with them. Like many other railroads' Acmes they are not marked in any way. In the Lantern Surveys there are some entries for "SS RY" (South Shore?) that have unknown listed for the railroad name. Or the South Shore may have not marked their lanterns. Posted Monday, January 21, 2013 by KM

 Q2494 1909 A&W Lantern  A friend, cleaning out my attic, just found a railroad lantern frame with the markings - on the very top CHICAGO NEW YORK, next 'tier' THE ADAMS AND WESTLAKE COMPANY, Next tier-M.C.R.R., then on bottom tier of top part of lantern-3 PATS. JAN. 26. 1909 and on the other side MAY 1 1895 MAY 8 1908 (these latter nos. are indistinct). My Grandmother's father worked for the railroad-I believe out of Durand, Michigan. I remember her telling stories about how she (my grandmother) got to travel anywhere for free because her father worked for the railroad. Any information you could give me about the lantern and its history would be appreciated. Thank you.  Posted Monday, January 21, 2013 by JF   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. It's probably from the Michigan Central Posted Tuesday, January 22, 2013 by BK

 Q2492 Minot Heaters on Lantern Burners  I recently picked up an 1897 model RRSL&LCO NPRR lantern, untouched and uncleaned for decades from the look of it,but was pleasantly surprised to see the brass burner was of the Minot heater variety. This is the 4th lantern in my collection to have this feature and 2 are NP and 2 are GN. Is this a mere coincidence or didn’t other roads find this burner to be useful when it came to keeping these old oil burning(not kerosene ) lanterns' fuel supply liquid in sub-zero temps? Did many other roads use these special burners or is it a feature somewhat unique to the upper west and Midwest US? I have heard of the ICRR using them but haven’t seen one on an actual IC lantern.  Posted Monday, January 21, 2013 by DJB   Post a Reply  Email a reply

 Q2487 Green Over White Globes  When did they stop the practice of using green over white lantern globes and would they have been inside any workday lantern the Conductor used a A&W, Keystone, Handlan etc.?  Posted Tuesday, January 15, 2013 by DEF   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. Handlan offered them in their 1918 catalog and Star Headlight listed them in their 1916 catalog. The link shows a page from the Handlan 1918 Catalog that is posted in the Library elsewhere on this site. See the listing for Model 111 & 112 Conductors lanterns with half colored globes. I can't help you with a date for how long they were in use, I am pretty sure that they were banned at some point though.  Link 1  Posted Thursday, January 17, 2013 by KM

A. I'll offer guess here. I believe a green/white globe in a "workday" lantern was often used at flagstops after dark to alert on oncoming train of a passenger(s) waiting to board. Their use probably ended when lanterns, and thus globes, were downsized in the 20's. I would guess they were replaced by two short globes, a green and a white used together. The rules may have varied by railroad. I remember riding the Budd cars on the CPR Havelock branch in the 1970's and the waiting room at Norwood was equipped with both a green and a white CPR Kero for passengers to light after dark to signal a passenger stop. A green and white metal flag placed on the train order mast by the passenger(s)was used during the day. During the stop, the conductor would take the flag off the train order mast and put it back in the depot and check to make sure the Keros (and matches) were still there. I never had the privilege of lighting the Keros as my trips were always on the morning train during the summer. And no, I never took a lantern. I knew this tradition would be gone all too soon, even without my "help".  Posted Friday, January 18, 2013 by JFR

A. Info from the Encyclopedia of RR Lighting shows a patent for two color ('half-color') globes issued in 1868, and as mentioned above by 1875 all of the major lantern manufacturers made smaller, generally fancier 'Conductor's Lanterns' for which two-color globes were the standard globe offered -- so they certainly did get a considerable amount of 'workday' use. Usually the purchaser could choose red/clear or blue/clear in addition to green/clear. I believe 'conductor' here refers almost exclusively to 'passenger train conductor.' The reason given for coloring the top of the globe was to minimize disturbance to the passengers as the conductor passed thru the train at night collecting tickets. The conductor had only limited need for the lantern for signalling; the flagman and brakemen did that; the conductor really only needed working light inside the train. And the freight conductors could easily use the regular lanterns provided by the railroad company; they had no need of the two-color arrangement. As also indicated above the major manufacturers offered these lanterns up to about 1920. By that time basically all passenger cars had electric lights and electric hand lanterns (and flashlights) were also coming into use -- so by even 1920 many of the 'Conductor Lantern' sales were probably for gifts and ceremonial purposes rather than 'real' service. A section of a Peter Gray catalog in the Encyclopedia shows Conductor Lantern two color globes priced at $1.50 per globe in 1892; a rough escalation shows that would be $37.50 today (plus shipping.)-- so they were a pricey item even then.  Posted Thursday, January 24, 2013 by RJMc

 Q2482 Lantern/Lamp Info Needed  Here is a picture of two lanterns I have, marked Adams & Westlake Co. Chicago, Pat Nov 3,85. What can you tell me about it. What's it called?   [Click on image for larger version.] Posted Monday, January 7, 2013 by MM   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. These are railroad passenger car double chandelier lamps and they are upside down right now. They hung from the round plates in the celing in the clerestory area. This is the first time that I have seen those large round plates so they may not be A&W original. There are two patents from 11/3/1885,329718 and 329535 and you can look those up in Google Patent Search. There are other qusetions about similar lamps in our Archives, see 1640,1559,1146,764 and 570. There have also been qusetions posted at The Lampguild Q&A see Q1, 481, 1086 and 3362. The Lampguild site is down right now for updating so check it out in a week or two. If you are going to restore these finding parts will be tough. One source might be Dan Edmonson at The Lampworks, see the link for his website. If you have to electri-fry them try to do as little damage as possible. The second link is for The Lampguild but as I mentioned the site is down for a while right now. Link 1  Link 2  Posted Tuesday, January 8, 2013 by KM

 Q2480 SV Lantern  I picked up this lantern in Virginia from a retired Norfolk Southern signal maintainer whose father retired from the N&W. The lantern is from the Shenandoah Valley Railroad. It is missing the glass and I'm not sure what type of base it used to have as well. There are a few patent dates on the bottom that I can't make out. Does anyone know who manufactured this lantern or have any more information on it? Thank You,  [Click on image for larger version.] Posted Monday, January 7, 2013 by BS   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. This is a classic no. 39 Adams and Westlake bellbottom lantern made in the mid-1880s. This one has a one-piece, deep-draw lid, and a wire frame with a single horizontal globe guard. The bottom cylinder has a bayonet catch which accepts a tin base with the draft holes in the bayonet collar. This is a different configuration than the common A&W model of this era, which is normally found with the draft holes in the bottom cylinder, and a standard no.39 bayonet collar. It looks like someone has inserted some kind of fount into the bottom cylinder, but this lantern needs a tin base/fount assembly complete with the correct bottom draft collar. A PRR bellbottom from this era would be the most common source of parts needed to make the SV lantern complete. Posted Wednesday, January 9, 2013 by ASwoyer

A. Thanks for the great info!  Posted Sunday, January 13, 2013 by BS

 Q2479 Handlan Caboose Lantern  I have a Handlan Caboose Lantern, AT&SF. I'm Looking for years made and instruction for flat wick system, i.e. how to load a new wick, trim it, etc.  Posted Saturday, January 5, 2013 by SW   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. Can you please post a picture to see exactly what you have? It would be helpful. Posted Monday, January 14, 2013 by JN

 Q2474 Vesta from Hong Kong?  I have a Dietz-vesta railroad lantern marked L.V.R.R. (Lehigh Valley RailRoad). No patent date on the top of lid. Only new york and USA on top with n oval circle marked Dietz and Vesta underneath. How can I find out if this was made in HongKong? I am reading that after 1956, [manufacturing] moved to China. Any other distinguishing marks that would tell me where it is from?  Posted Wednesday, January 2, 2013 by Jim N   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. Your Vesta was made in Syracuse New York USA, hence the "Dietz New York" marking. It would by law have "Made in Hong Kong" on it if it was an import. Dietz ceased production of the Rail Road Vesta in 1959 and ceased all production in the USA in 1971. See link 1 from Woody's web site on Dietz history., Link 1  Posted Wednesday, January 2, 2013 by JL

 Q2472 Lamp Info Needed  I would like help in identifying where this lamp would have been used and any information about it. I just received it from a friend but have not been successful in finding anything on the Internet because I do not know exactly what it is. I presume it is from CNR because of the CN marking on both the front and bottom of the lamp. Thank you.   [Click on image for larger version.] Posted Monday, December 31, 2012 by SR   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. This is most probably a caboose lamp.  Posted Monday, December 31, 2012 by BK

A. Thank you. Caboose lamp was the name I needed. I have now found information online that fills in the blanks. Posted Monday, December 31, 2012 by SR

A. Also enter 2340 in the 'Archives By Question Number' here on this Board for a lot more info and prior questions on caboose lamps.  Posted Tuesday, January 1, 2013 by RJMc

 Q2468 Lamp Fuel Font  Does anyone know how old this fuel font is? What type of lamp it went in to? Specific one? Date range?   [Click on image for larger version.] Posted Thursday, December 27, 2012 by JC   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. See the answers to prior Q Q2114 Fuel Pot Handle, stating that the rectangular bent wire ('fuel pot handle') was a relatively late innovation (probably meaning 1960's) in Adlake switch lamp design.  Posted Thursday, December 27, 2012 by RJMc

A. The link to an Adlake catalog elsewhere on this RRiana Site shows this type of fuel font in an Adams & Westlake (Adlake) #1112 switch lamp. There are several Adlake catalogs available there. As to specific dates, this is difficult because that same general lamp design was used over many decades. Particular features of this font, such as the wire above the chimney and the flat metal grips for the chimney base (often wire, rather than metal strips) will hopefully assist in dating it with some further research of prior Q's here.  Link 1  Posted Thursday, December 27, 2012 by RJMc

A. I am thinking that your particular kerosene fount is late-60's to early-70's and my reasoning is that Adlake has by now eliminated the filler cap assembly as both an extra expense plus the fact that most maintenance employees didn't use this feature because it was very hard to unscrew the brass filler cap with bare fingers and impossible with gloves on.It was much easier to unscrew the burner assembly to fill the fount and that would also allow time to wipe off the glass chimney if the particular railroad still used them.Your fount looks it age but sitting for years unused without oil in it,took its toll.You can also date Adlake's #270 marker founts by noting if it does or doesn't have the filler cap assembly.Maybe Red Beard will make a comment or two.DJB  Posted Friday, December 28, 2012 by DJB

A.  DJB knows I like to ramble on and that I’d probably take the bait on this one ;) -- Regarding the above and previous comments : RJMc, TE & DJB; I always appreciate reading your input. By 1975, pretty much all of the kerosene lamps had been retired on the Mid-West roads I saw on a daily basis; that’s a long time ago and it’s good to have discussions on here with some guys that remember details about these amazing lamps (some of those details I’ve forgotten or didn’t pay attention to in the first place.) -- -- Regarding AGE: All of the pots with this style of handle I ever encountered back in the ‘60s and ‘70s were in very new to mint condition, leading me to believe that they were a late production item. I probably saw them as early as the late 1960s. -- What Lamps Used In ? : Several; see below -- Burner Clues: always remember that burners are pretty much universally interchangeable. Hard to date a pot or a lamp by its burner as it could have been exchanged at any time. Replacement founts and burners would have been ordered and shipped separately, not as a unit. Lamps came complete, only needing fuel; but again, a burner could have been substituted, intentionally or inadvertently, during routine maintenance. --- Condition: everything corrodes over time. Kerosene lamps in general vanished from the railroads roughly 40 years ago. The aging on this pot, though, doesn’t look like post railroad / storage aging. The condition and patterns on the side of the pot are consistent with, and indicative of, having been used for some time. -- Regarding Brass Filler Caps: In answering one question some time back, TE mentioned that they were commonly pierced to create a vent hole. I have several, and have seen others, that were pierced with a pen knife blade (slight wedge shape). My guess is that the maintainer’s pen knife was from then on also used as a screw driver to get the cap off. ...and, with WD-40 and all, I have some I -STILL- can’t unscrew !!! --- --- With an oil burning lamp, there has to be some way to get the oil pot in and out of the lamp so it can be refilled and cleaned. From that standpoint there are three basic styles of kerosene Switch Lamps; those with a sliding side door and those with a hinged top (top opening) are the most common. The third being the Adlake model 63 style we discussed a bit in Q2441; ..a very early design, c. 1900. The #63 lamps had an open bottom body and a special oil pot that was inserted up through the open bottom of the lamp. The three major American lamp manufacturers, Adlake, Dressel and Handlan, each made both side door and top opening lamps, though all late model Handlans were side door design. As RJMc mentions above, the oil pot in this question was designed for the Adlake 1112 lamp. ..It would also fit in any hinged top lamp from other manufacturers, as would any round Adlake pot regardless of the handle style - Oil pots were meant to be interchangeable. - Various Adlake pots show up in Dressel and Handlan lamps frequently in eBay listings, which is not surprising, as lamps in railroad service often had an oil pot from a different manufacturer; It made no difference to the lamp tender servicing the lamp in day to day operation. Interchangeable lamp parts were used in a mix and match fashion all the time in railroad service. -- Pots were also subject to having the bottom rust out from water that inevitably accumulated in the pot, which meant some pots needed to be replaced from time to time. From closely watching eBay listings, and from my own recollection, there seem to be more Adlake pots in Dressel lamps than vice versa, which makes me think that railroads ordered more replacement pots from Adlake. The pot in this question could have come in a new Adlake #1112 lamp in the later production years, or it could have been purchased as one in a case full of replacement pots; possibly being placed, when new, directly in an existing Dressel, or older Handlan, hinge top lamp. -- Regarding Round Pots in Dressel & Handlan hinge top lamps: The lower portion of the body of the Adlake 1112 or 169 lamp is of a diameter just the right size to accommodate this style of round pot, the fount-well being of a smaller diameter than the spherical part of the 1112 / 169 lamp body where the lenses are mounted. (#1112 / 169 Adlakes have somewhat of a Coke Bottle profile) This smaller diameter fount-well where the pot sat, kept the pot, burner, and subsequently the flame, nicely centered and equidistant from the back of all four lenses. In Q2441 I talked about the Focal Length of the Lenses and how the lens had to be held a very specific distance (focal length) from the light source for the lens to be in focus and project the lamp’s light so that it could clearly be seen at ANY distance, near or far. Light from a non-properly focused lens will practically disappear at distance (sometimes as little as 50 feet from the lamp) and appear dim or even dark rather than lit. -- Dressel and Handlan hinge top lamps have a straight sided cylindrical body very much like any sliding side door lamp. The body of these lamps is about 6-1/4 inches in diameter. A round pot is only about 4-1/8 inches in diameter; that leaves quite a bit of room in there for the pot to rattle around! Again, the light source needs to be centered in the lamp for proper lens focus, so the smaller round pot needed to be held securely centered in the larger diameter lamp. The solution was to insert a sheet metal shoulder clear around the lower inside of the hinge top lamps (think of an upside down ‘Top Hat’ ), so as to hold the pot in a securely centered position. The reason I mention this is that many hinge top lamps that show up on eBay are missing this centering insert! In the later years some hinge top lamps in railroad service could be found without this insert, but not many. Certainly the lamps without the collar would have gone in and out of focus constantly as the pot bounced around inside the lamp with each passing car. --- An Oddity would be the Great Northern No. 4 & No. 5 switch lamps which had a fork mount, cylindrical, hinge top body: The classic round top, round base Adlakes that the UP and SP used in such quantities as to be synonymous with those roads (model #169, similar in shape to a Square Top 1112) were fork mounted (4.5 in. lenses all around). Great Northern and Northern Pacific had #169 lamps as well but with larger lenses; 5” green and 5-3/8” yellow or red. On all of those, the fork mount tubes just clear the outside of the small diameter fount-well of #169 or #1112 lamps, with a half inch of daylight between the body and the tubes. (of note; the GN & NP lamps had fork tubes that were 3.5 inches longer than the UP/SP lamps, protruding clear up well into the spherical part of the model 169 lamps). As lamps evolved in design, the cylindrical body, side door lamps were built to accommodate the newer and larger, semi-rectangular fount, like the Adlake #28. The side door on the lamp and the semi-rectangular oil pot maximized the amount of oil a lamp could hold. Structurally, the side door needed to be about one fourth of the circumference of the lamp body; that established how wide a fount could be and still fit through the door. In order to squeeze as much cubic inch volume into the founts as possible, they were designed with the rounded ends so as to make use of as much space inside of the lamp as possible. These new semi-rectangular founts slid easily in and out of the lamp through the side door, yet nearly touched the walls of the lamp when the door was closed. - The GN had thousands and thousands of Switch Stands with fork mounts; a system wide standard. Any new lamps had to conform to that fork mount standard. The newer side door lamps with their very desirable larger capacity founts posed an insurmountable problem however; you can’t build them with fork mount tubes in them. The tubes have to sit at a 45° angle to the center axis of the lenses and in that position inside the lamp, they block the fount from being inserted through a side door; remember the sliding door also has to be in a very exact position on the lamp. The two can’t be made to mix! There is no physical way around that. - Adlake designed a highly modified cylindrical lamp for the GN. The semi-rectangular founts pretty much fill the full diameter of the lamp, making them very difficult to insert through the top of a typical hinged top lamp. The new GN lamps had a somewhat flat lid that looks oversized. The lid was wide enough to cover a specially designed collar that slipped over the outside top edge of the lamp. A fold and groove arrangement in this collar also provided the windproof seal with the cylindrical flange around the bottom edge of the lid. A special extra clearance hinge for the lid was attached to the outside collar in a way such that when the top was opened it revealed an unobstructed bore the full diameter of the inside of the lamp, so the semi-rectangular fount could be dropped down through the top of the lamp. However; the clearance was so tight that the hinge rivets got in the way. The pot had to be inserted with a flat edge facing the rivets in order to pass into the top of the lamp, and then be twisted back counter clockwise a bit to pass by the fork mount tubes! ...though still with some difficulty, and the occasional scraped knuckle, as it is a pretty tight fit. So tight that dents of much size in certain areas could also prevent removal of the fount. These lamps had to be kept very clean inside as any accumulation of dirt or soot on the interior sides of the lamp would make it difficult or impossible to remove the pot until the walls were scraped clean. I would guess that the lamp tenders were not real happy with these lamps for several reasons. -- A top opening Dressel also opens up wide enough to give unobstructed access into the lamp, but the lid/body/hinge arrangement is not nearly as interesting. Also, the opening on a Dressel won’t quite pass a semi-rectangular fount either. The body of the fount will fit, but lip of the fount lid catches and won’t pass. To date, I haven’t seen a Top Opening Dressel with a semi-rectangular fount in it. -- The UP and SP simply had fork mount tubes put on the new 1112 lamps and put up with the original smaller round pots. .... Red Beard -- © 2012, Red Beard the Railroad Raider  Posted Saturday, December 29, 2012 by Red Beard the Railroad Raider

 Q2466 Ry vs RR on LS&I Kero  I have an opportunity to buy a Lake Superior & Ishpeming Ry Adlake Kero but am concerned about its authenticity since it is a later Kero dated 3-59 but marked LS&I Ry on the brim. I would think that any modern version of a lantern from this company would be marked RR instead of Ry. According to the company history the LS&I Ry ceased to exist in the 1920s and most of their lanterns were Adlake Reliables marked Ry. The letters have been strongly embossed on the brim and look pretty good. Any thoughts about this lantern are appreciated.  Posted Sunday, December 23, 2012 by BS   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. The lantern survey listings are definitely not complete, so consider them as a work in progress. Posted Tuesday, December 25, 2012 by Web Editor

A. I have mixed feelings about this. On Ebay right now there is an LSI RY bare top Kero embossed on the top. I don't like the embossed lettering on the top, it doesn't look right. Too large for the younger age of that lantern, bad spacing, only one period between LSI and RY and poorly spaced. The Lantern Surveys don't show any Adlake short globes or lanterns with LSI either. All that besides the RY. RR issue makes me wonder if someone didn't fake it some time ago and now it is showing up as an original. However... I have looked at lanterns in my own collection, two NKP and two N.&S.S. RY some PRR and B&O's. The lettering style, size and position do appear to be what Adlake used in the late 1950 period. I have a Newburgh and South Shore Ry production date 1-57 in front of me right now that has the same lettering, and another N.&S.S. production date 1/36 with much smaller lettering. The look of the ampersand bothers me on the eBay lantern, but the S,R,Y,and & are identical to mine on the N&SS lantern. Similar to the NKP lanterns that I have. Older one dated in the 30's has small lettering, large lettering. dated 4/57. So maybe this is legit. As small as the LS&I is they probably didn't order very many lanterns so the Lantern Survey may never have had any reported. Posted Tuesday, December 25, 2012 by KM

A. I see the same LS & I lantern that "KM" commented on and it looks perfectly legitimate to me. I have several DM & IR lanterns from the same and later time periods and the ampersand and lettering style is identical to the LS & I lantern. Regarding RR vs. Ry and bad letter spacing, missing periods, and so on; please remember these lanterns started life as low priced industrial items, and not Tiffany lamps. Adlake was trying to make money, and probably wasn't interested in having some guy spend an hour using a caliper making sure letter spacing was right and then having an English major stop by to check if the periods were correct. It is highly unlikely that someone is going to go through the trouble of buying up unmarked Adlake Keros, making up a die, and stamping the lanterns; all to turn a $40 lantern into a $100 - $125 lantern. Or if stamping New York Central System (NYCS), turning a $40 lantern into a $30 lantern. Some of my DM & IR Keros are marked DM & IR Ry, and some just DM & IR, with the "Ry" missing. These are just two stamping variations of the railroad name and nothing I ever got excited about. One lantern has very narrow spacing between D and M and quite wide spacing between I and R, with the one and only period right in the middle of the spacing (DM& I . R).  Posted Tuesday, December 25, 2012 by JEM

A. Re the LS&IRY lantern you are talking about,I have an identical lantern to this one,including the markings and the date code on mine is 2-61.I got mine while employed by a competing railroad who interchanged with them,in 1978,thru another employee.Except for having been used a few times,my lamp has the same lettering type and spacing,top cap markings and all other details.Your lamp is absolutely authentic.Another contributor JEM hit it on the head with his remarks.These were everyday work tools and they were not designed or produced for the enjoyment of the collecting community and each production run wasn't absolutely identical.As for RY or RR on a lantern,I personally believe that this varied by the whims of the stamping machine operator on any given day.Comments? DJB Posted Wednesday, December 26, 2012 by DJB

A. Just a note about the Ebay LS & I lantern mentioned above. It sold for $212.50, which is a really good price for a short globe lantern.  Posted Wednesday, January 2, 2013 by JEM

 Q2463 Age of Lamp  We lost our home in a recent wildfire and are working on our contents list for insurance. We had 'The Adlake Non-Sweating Lamp Chicago' as stated on the top of the lamp, with 3 green lenses and 1 red one, and are trying to determine when these lamps were in use, or what it's age might be. Any clues? Would certainly appreciate it. Thanks.  Posted Sunday, December 23, 2012 by SL   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. As you listed the wording "The Adlake Non-Sweating Lamp Chicago", in that order, I'm guessing that it is a Square Top Lamp as the Round Top Lamps say "The Non-Sweating Adlake Lamp Chicago", with "Non Sweating" on the line above ADLAKE on Round Top lamps. If it is a Square Top Lamp, that would date it anywhere from the mid 1920s to the mid 1970s . Round Top Lamps were produced from the early 1900s to the mid 1920s. If the one red and three green lenses were original to the lamp, it would be a Marker Lamp see Links 1 & 2 and see if your lamp looked like those. -- If so, I'd look on eBay for similar Marker Lamps and track what they end up selling for and see if the insurance company will accept that as a value. --- Get an eBay account and that will allow you to track items and look to see what they end up selling for after the auction is over. You need to add the item to your "Watch List" while you are signed in to your account. -- I'd also save the burnt out shell of the lamp and attempt to restore it, as replacement parts and lenses are listed frequently --- ...Red Beard Link 1  Link 2  Posted Sunday, December 23, 2012 by Red Beard the Railroad Raider

A. Addendum: Regarding age and value; The Model 270 and 1221 Marker Lamp in the Links above are hard to date more specifically than the wide parameter I listed. They really didn’t change in appearance or design over the decades. Their value is not tied so much to their specific age (which really can’t be determined) as to the model type, general desirability and current market demand. Marker Lamps in general have a higher market appeal than Switch Lamps and usually fetch higher prices at auction. The fact that a Square Top Lamp is not as old as a similar Round Top Lamp is in no way an indication that the newer model Square Top is any less desirable or valuable than the older Round Top Lamp; on any given day one could sell for more or less than the other. -- If you need additional help, send the Web Site Editor your contact information and ask him to forward it to me and I’ll see what I can do. - My neighborhood was in a fire evacuation zone a few years back as well ! --- ....Red Beard Posted Monday, December 24, 2012 by Red Beard the Railroad Raider

 Q2462 GTR Lantern  I recently won the lantern that I will describe at a New England railroadiana auction. It is a Grand Trunk Railway 3-way (or 3-aspect) British-style trackwalker's lantern with colorless, red, and green lenses. It is unmarked except for a stamped 'GTR' on the sloped side of the rotating top. It looks to be much older and not of the same style as the Piper-made (or Piper-licensed) 3-way lanterns seen in later Piper catalogs (I own one of these and it is Piper-marked). So.............. Does anyone have any idea as to the approximate timeline of manufacture/sale of this lantern and the manufacturer(s)? Thanks, in advance, for any assistance that the readers can provide.  Posted Wednesday, December 19, 2012 by DG   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. A photograph would be a great help. Posted Friday, December 21, 2012 by JAJ

A. The GTR was British owned and managed, so it as quite possible that handlamps, as they are called in the UK, were supplied by British manufacturers, at least until Pipers of Montreal began supplying them. Lamps of this type were used universally on British railways (the "globe" lantern being unknown here) from the 1840s until 1965. There are many different design variations, made by a host of manufacturers large and small, which makes identifying and dating a lamp difficult, especially without a photo.  Posted Saturday, December 29, 2012 by JAJ

 Q2460 Adlake Lamp/Lantern Info Needed  I looked through all of your info and couldn't find anything. My friend has a Adlake lantern w/ serial no. 86025 Frisco 1970 in raised letters in the lanterns back & base. The lantern is a little bigger than a basketball w. 2 green lights, & 2 red lights, the lenses are plastic. The lantern is hard metal w. a round top, the base is smaller and looks as if there is where it was bolted down and the light came up from below. If you could help with any information we would appreciate it. We aren't into taking pictures, to send you, sorry. Thank you,  Posted Tuesday, December 18, 2012 by Roger   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. See the link below, which takes you to the 'Lamps' page elsewhere on this RRiana site; there is a lot more info there on this type of lamp, which almost certainly is a switch lamp. There are further references on the Lamps page to much more info on other pages on this site.  Link 1  Posted Tuesday, December 18, 2012 by RJMc

A. Sounds like you have an Adams&Westlake round switch lamp. There is a 1940 Adlake Catalog available in the Articles and Library section elsewhere on this site. The link shows the pages for the model 1379 switch lamp from that catalog. Link 1  Posted Tuesday, December 18, 2012 by KM

A. That’s an interesting description. I’m betting you know someone with a cell phone that can take photos. Ask them to help you send in a photo or two of your lamp. With a photo we can probably give you some exact information about your lamp. -- ...Red Beard Posted Wednesday, December 19, 2012 by Red Beard the Railroad Raider

 Q2458 Headlight  Hello. I am very new to collecting railroad items, I Just picked up this headlight. It is marked Pyle-National Company across the top. On the bottom, it says Chicago.U.S.A. then it appears to have 14001 KF casted into the edge. Any ideas of what this may have come off of? It is fairly large and has a glass reflector. Thanks for any help!  Posted Sunday, December 16, 2012 by Tim   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. Here's a pic.  Posted Sunday, December 16, 2012 by Tim

A. We'll try this for a pic. http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f86/gretsch57/1355680614.jpg  Link 1  Posted Sunday, December 16, 2012 by Tim

A. Tim, Most likely this is a back-up light from a steam engine tender. The tapered body is a give away. A few of these may have been used as a headlight for instance on the C&O shifters sold to the N&W late in steam. Gary Posted Sunday, December 16, 2012 by GaryP

A. Thanks! Do you know of anyplace I might find a pic of it being used in any of both situations? C&O shifters? Not familliar...yet. :) thanks!  Posted Sunday, December 16, 2012 by Tim

A. Might this link show this headlight? Link 1  Posted Sunday, December 16, 2012 by Tim

A. "shifter" is another name for a switch engine. Gary is referring to C&O #255 through 280 which were 0-8-0 superheated steam switch engines called class C-16. They were sold to the N&W and I think they retained those same road numbers, the N&W called them the S-1 class. Also C&O 0-8-0's #240 through 254 were sold to the Virginian and then ended up on the N&W after the merger of the Virginian and the N&W. Those engines became N&W class S-1a. Sorry,I haven't come up with any photos of them yet.  Posted Sunday, December 16, 2012 by KM

A. Its very difficult to tell where lights like this may come from, because they were often used as general-purpose floodlights and spotlights in many industries, not just RR's. They were often mounted on light towers and building roofs to light factory yards and parking lots, for example. But they definitely WERE also used on the RR's; see the Link for a pic of a UP wrecking crane with what looks like two of these (or very similar; Pyle made a very wide variety of models) mounted on the roof. Another RR that liked the taper-back headlight style was the New York Central, although they usually added side number boards. One clue to locomotive use would have been the bulb, if it was available. Almost all steam locomotive lighting was done at 32 Volts DC, and almost all other industrial lighting would have been 120 Volts AC, and the bulbs were marked accordingly (at least when new). However, the locomotive bulbs DID use the same screw thread base as common household bulbs, which is why authentic headlights (and back up lights) can be readily converted to regular bulbs and lit on house power (but make sure the wiring insulation is in safe condition.) Link 1  Posted Sunday, December 16, 2012 by RJMc

A. From RR Picture Archives.net this is a great 3/4 front detail view of N&W 283, ex C&O 283, taken in Roanoke in 1957 that shows the headlight details. It sure looks close to or the same as your headlight so the C&O engines might be a possibility but its a big maybe. The best that you could hope for is to find some marking like a steel stamp mark or even a chalk marked number that the railroad put on the headlight when they removed it during a rebuild so take a close look before you clean it up.  Link 1  Posted Monday, December 17, 2012 by KM

 Q2457 HS Hamm Company  I bought a Adams & Westlake lantern with a heavy metal ring on it's bottom, I looked up all the patent numbers on the bottom and they come up HS Hamm Company. Did Adams & Westlake buy out H.S. Hamm, After they went under?  Posted Saturday, December 15, 2012 by MW   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. I mean the W.S. Hamm Posted Saturday, December 15, 2012 by mike

A. Sorry, here is the correct link for the second patent. Link 1  Posted Saturday, December 15, 2012 by KM

A. William S. Hamm probably worked for Adlake. In "The encyclopedia Of Rarailroad Lighting:Volume 1,The Railroad Lantern" starting on page 329 there is a list of "Selected Lantern Patents." Checking that list shows 9 patents issued to William S. Hamm from 1905 to 1928. All but two of them are assigned to Adlake. The two are for a twisted wire loop bail and a bail that rotated around so that the lantern would stay vertical when being swung for signaling. I don't think those inventions ever caught on and may not have been produced. See the links for patents 794297 and 794298 from 7/11/1905. Link 1  Link 2  Posted Saturday, December 15, 2012 by KM

 Q2455 A&K Ry Marking  I have an Armspear tall globe (5 3/8) with a marker light bracket marked A&K. RY. I'm not sure which railroad this came from. research shows Androscoggin & Kennebec , Allegeny & Kinzua , Augusta & Knoxville. I think it's Augusta because of the dates in which the railroads were in operation. is it possible that this was a trolley line? Thanks.  Posted Thursday, December 13, 2012 by DF   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. The Androscoggin & Kennebec Railway Company that incorporated in Lewiston,Maine in 1919 was an interurban line. That is different from the Androscoggin & Kennebec Railroad that was much older and which became part of the Maine Central. The Andro. & Kennebec Railway Co. is the only A&K listing which is shown in "The Trolley and Interurban Directory" by Joseph Gross. Gross says that they had 8 miles of track but that may be wrong. See the link for an article written in 1922 from "United States Investor" that says they had 157 miles and describes the main routes and branch lines.  Link 1  Posted Thursday, December 13, 2012 by KM

A. This link is from Dave's Railpix.com and has photos of Maine interurban lines including 27 photos of Andrescoggins and Kennebec rolling stock. The second link shows one of their plows, which looks like a crude Jordan spreader with wings that can be extended to the sides. Link 1  Link 2  Posted Thursday, December 13, 2012 by KM

 Q2454 Dietz 39  Did Dietz make the 39 steel clad for a candle? I found a 39 steel clad that is stamped correctly on the top and on the top lid it is stamped City of New York but there is plate in place of the fount with ring for a candle and no Cut slot in side for the drop in burner adjuster it is the fixed handle [hanging model]. It appears to real but Is this a fake? I do not find any patent info on it. Thank You.  Posted Wednesday, December 12, 2012 by BH   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. See Q1926 and Q2134 in the Archives. 1926 shows a Dietz #39 with the candle and 2134 shows a lantern that is marked for Porter, but may have een made by C.T. Ham. Over the years there have been many of those City of New York lanterns sold on eBay but this is the first one that I have heard of that was candle powered. Posted Wednesday, December 12, 2012 by KM

A. Hi BH, The lantern you're describing is undoubtedly one of those common City of New York barricade lanterns with the flat steel band fixed bail (a photo would confirm that and more), these didn't come with a candle adapter, that's probably borrowed from another lantern or something. They commonly are fitted with a drop in fount and a Dietz "Convex" burner for kerosene or some replacement of the same standard size, Adlake, Dressel, etc. What I find odd is you stated there is no slot for the wick raiser shaft which usually means it is intended to have a signal oil burner with an inside wick raiser, an option that was offered on the older "beehive" top Steel Clads but I didn't see it listed for the later flat top models but that doesn't mean it didn't happen. The lantern shown in Q1926 shouldn't have a candle either, that one is a Dietz No.39 Conductors Lantern and is missing it's screw in signal oil fount and burner, a Convex burner was an option on it as well. The one in Q2134 is a Porter and I agree with KM it looks like a C.T. Ham product to me, I have no idea about the candle holder in it though, I've never seen one like it before.  Posted Wednesday, December 12, 2012 by W.M.

 Q2453 Dietz 1942 Brass Lantern  During the WWII era (1942) Dietz made the Vesta lantern in brass. How was it mostly used? For railroad maritime use or as a ship board lantern by the armed forces? Thank you.  Posted Monday, December 10, 2012 by Keith    Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. They were for marine use and were the replacement for the World Standard deck and dark lanterns used during WW1. They were found on both civilian and military ships. The US Light House Service also had some brass Vestas, I have seen one of those that appeared to be factory embossed USLHS and had a globe that was marked USLHS with cast lettering. There are also USLHS Vesta'a that are steel. I think Dietz called the brass Vestas "Navy Standard Deck Lantern". Posted Monday, December 10, 2012 by KM

 Q2452 Lense Question  I have a red lense from an old railroad lantern, I think. it is 5 d x 3 1/2 f s o made by Corning Glass. I am interested in what type of lamp this goes to. Any help?  Posted Saturday, December 8, 2012 by BM   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A.  That was a fairly common size of Fresnel lens. “5 D” is the diameter of the lens, indicating what size opening it would fit in. -- With “FSO 3-1/2” that would be an older lens. Is it also marked “1935”? -- 3-1/2 is the focal length of the lens; the distance from the optical center of the lens to the light source for correct focus. --- Does anyone know what the “SO” part of “FSO” stands for?? --- Newer lenses have the Focal Length designated by just an “F” --- Your lens could be from a switch lamp or a “Diving Helmet” style marker like the Adlake 1158 and 1175. Cast spherical electric markers (and classification lamps) from most manufacturers were offered with either 5 inch or 5-3/8 inch lenses. Many single lens lamps take a 5 inch lens also. I’ve never had my hands on a single lens marker (PRR / NH style), but have seen on line listings stating that some, at least, had a 5 inch red lens. -- In a switch lamp, 5 inch diameter lenses were usually paired with a different size lens for the other color. 5 inch red lenses would have most likely been paired with 4-1/2 inch green lenses in the same lamp. 5 inch green lenses would be paired with 5-3/8 inch lenses of either red, yellow or purple. I have lamps in both configurations (5 inch being either the smaller or larger lens), including a NYC lamp with 5 inch lunar white lenses paired with 5-3/8 inch yellow. Some railroads liked the idea of having two sizes of lenses in a switch lamp to prevent human error from placing the wrong color in one side of the lamp, thus giving a dangerously wrong indication when on the switch. Great Northern and Northern Pacific used 5 inch green lenses paired with 5-3/8 inch yellow and the GN main line lamps had 5-3/8 red with the 5 inch green. In all the lamps I’ve seen where there are two different size lenses in a lamp, the larger lens is always for the cautionary color; either red, yellow or purple; The smaller lens always being either green or lunar. To date, I haven’t seen a switch lamp with 5 inch lenses all around, though with so many variations produced, I would guess that there were some. Lamp manufacturers would build anything a railroad requested. --- ....Red Beard  Posted Saturday, December 8, 2012 by Red Beard the Railroad Raider

A. Addition: on derail lamps, many roads used Purple and Yellow lenses. In that combination yellow would be the smaller lens as Purple was the cautionary color indicating that the derail frog was in place on the track, ready to derail any passing car or loco passing over it. --- ...Red Beard Posted Monday, December 10, 2012 by Red Beard the Railroad Raider

 Q2449 Lamp Target  I’m restoring an Adlake #1112 that my dad used on the railroad that run from Chicago to New York. When he was a boy around 7 to high school, he worked a between the tracks water pickup trough that was located about 1/4 mi. east of Stryker Ohio. His one job in the winter was to keep the ice broken up and tossed out of the trough so trains could pick up water as they passed by. By the way some of the off track pieces can still be found there. Well my dad being the typical kid acquired a lamp with Aqua (green), and cobalt blue (purple) lenses. The unit has four day targets. Unfortunately it was panted a long time ago a pearl green all over. I’m restoring it, and decided the lamp body has to be painted on the outside because the zinc is gone where the lamp gets hot while running. It's in primer on the outside, along with the day targets, the lamp’s inside left bright. My problem is the day target colors. I've found some, I believe, reliable references that aqua (green) day targets should be white. I've found nothing for the rest of the lens colors, but of course I’m only really interested in the day target color for cobalt blue (purple). Can you help me with this color? Hoping to return the lamp to dad for Christmas.  Posted Monday, December 3, 2012 by KO   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. Sorry I don't have an answer to your main question but I'm curious about the statement about the lamp getting hot while running. The heat generated by a normally set flame height, should reach a level to do any harm to paint.  Posted Monday, December 3, 2012 by TE

A. excuse....I mean SHOULD NOT reach a level...... Posted Monday, December 3, 2012 by TE

A. You mention that your Adlake lamp was painted all over in a pearl green years ago.Those original day targets from Adlake were coated with a fired-on real porcelain finish.Paint remover will not harm porcelain so why not take all the paint off the targets and see what colors are underneath? You don't men tion trying this in your note.I have gotten several lamps over the years with painted targets and usually after removing the paint,I found some chipping of the porcelain which was the reason they were painted in the first place,often by the railroad.The chipping showed use scars and age. As for day target colors,many roads ordered green targets for the green lenses,but later changed them out for white targets or painted them white, because green did not show up well on low switches esp when there was brush and weeds around them.White was the original color for clear or proceed so white targets solved this visibility problem.Also,many roads used white around their lunar white lenses,but lunar white was also a restricted proceed indication,so it was permissible. As for the purple lenses,they really did make both purple and blue porcelain targets but they seem to be on the rare side and I suspect they were also hard to see on low switches.I have lamps with examples of both blue and purple targets so they do exist.Your switch lamp was most certainly used on a siding derail switchstand and I also have a NYCRR lamp in my collection in the green and purple lense configuration known to have been used on a derail.I hope this helps a bit and that you will try seeing what colors are on your targets from the factory.I am retired from the railroad so have seen these various lamps in actual use.  Posted Monday, December 3, 2012 by DJB

A. The railroad thru Stryker was the main line of the New York Central. The formal term they used was 'track pans' although a lot of people called them 'troughs'. They did use special signals with the pans to tell the fast-moving train crews when to lower and raise the water scoop under the tender to take water from the pan. The link has a discussion of the indications on these special signals and says lunar white indicated "OK to lower" and blue indicated "Raise" the scoop. As shown in later years single-head electric searchlight signals were used for the special track pan indications which were blue and lunar white. The second link is a very good compendium of NYC signal indications; the NYC had a lot of multi-track running and so had among the most complex set of signal indications. The link definitely acknowledges distinct uses for blue, purple, and lunar white indications. As to possible use of kerosene lamps at the track pans -- the pans were being installed as early as 1900, so the use of kerosene lamps on them may have been quite possible. If kerosene lamps were used they had no need to turn so there would be no need for side indications. But since the NYC main was a very heavy-duty high traffic line they would have needed lights at both ends of the pan, so a single lamp might have had lunar white on one side and blue on the other. I haven't been able to find my vintage NYC rule books yet to see if kerosene lamps may be shown at the track pans, and if so whether day targets were used. And a last thought; 'Perl(man) green' was a favorite color to paint many things on the latter-day NYC (such as cabooses...), so the paint may well have been applied on the RR.  Link 1  Link 2  Posted Monday, December 3, 2012 by RJMc

A. Stryker, OH has a historical website. The two links have good photos of trains taking water from the track pans at speed, probably about 1900. Unfortunately, no signal lights are visible in the photos, altho the first one is of a train approaching the exit end of the pans and a post is visible, which is probably the 'raise scoop' marker.....  Link 1  Link 2  Posted Monday, December 3, 2012 by RJMc

A. A little further searching turns up an 18 minute publicity film made by the NYCRR in the 1930's, all about how their steam locomotives work, at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZBFdpBol3l4 and also in the link below. At about 16 minutes in, they show the scoop apparatus under a tender, and then a train taking water from a track pan. Prominently in the middle of the frame is a signal light next to the pan; unfortunately, the film is in black and white......(!!) Link 1  Posted Monday, December 3, 2012 by RJMc

 Q2447 Wheel Cut Globes  Picked up a couple globes, both 7 inch red flashed. One of them has LVRR cut as shown in the photo. I know there are some lantern guys that respond on this site. Thought I'd run this by you and see what you thought. Letters look kind of crude to me, but these globes are probably so early that there was no 'standard' as far as cut letters go. Also the work was probably done locally (?). Any info is appreciated. Thanks.   [Click on image for larger version.] Posted Monday, November 26, 2012 by DA   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. 7" is not a very common RR sized globe. Quite possible someone took old globes and cut them. Posted Monday, November 26, 2012 by BK

A. This is a no. 7 Lake and River lantern globe that someone has cut the LVRR initials into. This is not a railroad lantern globe. Posted Tuesday, November 27, 2012 by ASwoyer

A. Thanks for the info !! Posted Friday, November 30, 2012 by DA

 Q2446 RR Lamp ID Needed  I was given this railroad lamp as a birthday present. I have been working as a train conductor for BNSF Railway for two years and have wanted a piece like this but I would like to know more about its history, use, etc... It has a red, a white, and a blue lens. It looks like it was not meant for handheld use as it has a bolt on one side where it clamped to something. When you open it up it has an adjustable wick for oil I assume. If anyone can give me more information on the use of this lamp/lantern and maybe time period. The only marking I found was on the top 'L4M78'. Thanks for your help!   [Click on image for larger version.] Posted Monday, November 26, 2012 by Steve   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. This is more likely and early auto or buggy lamp. Posted Monday, November 26, 2012 by BK

A. Kerosene tail and side lamps were used on trucks up into the 1920's. See Q1783 and Q1884 in the Archives for photos and examples of some of those. the bolt on the side tightened onto a fork or rod which was on the side of the body or cowl and that fastening system is not usually found on railroad lamps. The link shows a 1921 Kelley Springfield truck with a kerosene tail lamp hanging beneath it. Link 1  Posted Monday, November 26, 2012 by KM

 Q2443 Lamp ID Needed  I need help identifying this 1943 RR signal lamp. Can you help me please? Thanks!   [Click on image for larger version.] Posted Saturday, November 24, 2012 by Sandy   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. This appears to be a heavy-duty work light, as indicated by the heavy base; probably not for RR use. As a guess, the 1943 date and the slotted mask would indicate use in a 'blackout' mode which would occur in combat zones. Again as a guess, the very elaborate 'chimney' probably made the lamp OK to use in hazardous environments; it would prevent an explosion even if the lamp bulb broke while lighted (which could occur from impact damage in battle). Such dangerous combat environments might be encountered in handling powder in ammunition magazines or aviation gasoline handling on Navy ships, or around battery charging gasses (hydrogen) on submarines, for example. They also occur in many mines where explosive gasses can accumulate, but the 'blackout' feature is much less likely needed in a mining application. And foreign navies would have the same requirements; are there any manufacturer's marks or other ID to indicate country of manufacture or use, or military part numbers?  Posted Monday, November 26, 2012 by RJMc

A. thanks for your response. I cannot make out any other marks since the lamp is pretty corroded and scratched from use. If you find out any more information please let me know. Sandy  Posted Friday, November 30, 2012 by Sandy

A. I am convinced that this not at all a heavy duty lamp. The base, in fact, the whole lamp is very lightweight. I have 2 similar lamps, although different in details, and they are in fact candle holders. One of mine is dated 1918 so I would rather like to think it is a military lamp.  Posted Saturday, December 17, 2016 by Marnix

 Q2442 Roberts Safety Lantern  I haven't been able to find very much info on the Roberts Safety Lantern. Have found only one site with little info. None on E-bay. I assume it to be very rare in the collectors world. Is it? Is there a site or person that has knowledge about these lanterns? And thank-you,  Posted Monday, November 19, 2012 by BF   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. See pg 245 in "The Illustrated Encylopedia of RR Lighting - Vol 1" for info. Posted Tuesday, November 20, 2012 by BK

A. The ones that I have and have seen have been Star Headlight Products. The only railroad marked ones that I have found have been for DL&W RR. Posted Tuesday, November 20, 2012 by JR

A. The links are for the Roberts Safety Lantern patents from 1910. The first patent shows his device on a railroad lantern and the second patent shows a tubular lantern with his ignition system. I am not sure whether that is his sytem installed on someone else's lantern or if Roberts made the whole lantern. He used a short friction match or "igniter" that was struck against the friction surface by pushing a button to cause the flame for the wick to be lit. I guess you still had to take apart the lantern after each time that you lit it to install another match. Roberts was located in Scranton,PA so it is not surprising that the DL&W would be a customer. Link 1  Link 2  Posted Thursday, November 22, 2012 by KM

A.  After reading through the patents again it looks like you could put four matches into the holder at one time and when you turned the button you could (try to) light the lantern four times. The patents also imply that this was an add-on device and not a whole lantern made by Roberts. Does anyone have one of these that works? It looks like Roberts converted other manufacturer's lanterns to his device in his own plant. Does anyone have a lantern with the system on it that is not made by Star Headlight? The lantern which is shown on page 246 in "The Illustrated Encyclopedia Of Railroad Lighting" looks like it is Star No. 39 Posted Saturday, November 24, 2012 by KM

A.  The first link is for Collector's Weekly website and shows a DL&W Star lantern with the Roberts mechanism. They also say that C.T.Ham, Kelley Lamp and possibly Steam Gauge and Lantern private branded lanterns for Roberts. The second link is from Flickr.com shows a brasstop C.T.Ham from the N.Y.O.& W. with the Roberts device. While the patents are from 1910 Roberts may have been making the device as far back as 1880 and until 1915. As to rarity, the older the lantern, whether it is railroad marked, who made it, and condition all determine that, but any Roberts lantern would be nice to have. Link 1  Link 2  Posted Saturday, November 24, 2012 by KM

 Q2439 H&BT Lantern  I recently came upon a nice Dietz Vesta lantern that has the letters H&BT stamped into the brim of the lantern. The lantern has a last patent date of Dec 25, 1928 as well as previous dates back to June 09. I am assuming the letters stand for Huntingdon & Broad Top RR, but am questioning whether this is a legit lantern marked by the shop? Thanks for any information you can provide.  Posted Monday, November 12, 2012 by BS   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. Kinda hard to tell wo a pix. The H&BT did have Vestas. I saw one a few years ago at a flea market that was factory marked. Posted Monday, November 12, 2012 by BK

A. Is there a production date on it? That should be the last date under the list of patent dates, it should read S for Dietzs' Syracuse plant then a number for a month and a number for the year. I.E. S 9 33 is Syracuse Sept. 1933. The link is for a Worthpoint listing that shows a Vesta that was sold on eBay in March 2012. That lantern is "shop marked by the railroad" and the seller guaranteed the auththenticity. I guess that means it was marked with a steel stamp set (not embossed at the factory) which anyone can do so perhaps you are right to have your doubts about this. Also that lantern has the newer serrated edge font instead of the older smooth edge font so it might be a newer Vesta. Although the smooth side font could have been replaced at some time since they are interchangeable. In the Lantern Surveys found in the Library elsewhere on this site there are 5&3/8" globes etched H&BTM for Huntingdon and Broad Top Mountain, not H&BT. The survey does not mention a factory marked H&BT Vesta, but that may just be due to lack of information about it. Link 1  Posted Monday, November 12, 2012 by KM

A. The production date is S-5-31 and seems to be a shop marked H&BT on the brim near the handle. Posted Wednesday, November 14, 2012 by WSS

 Q2437 RR Initials  I have a railroad lantern with the letters B.L. &. C. R. R. embossed on the frame. The clear glass globe is labeled B.& M. R. R., which I recognize. Do you have any idea what the frame letters stand for?  Posted Sunday, November 11, 2012 by BC   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. Possibly BOSTON, LOWELL & CONCORD, Here is a website to find RR names in the future http://www.railroadiana.org/pgRRNames.php  Posted Sunday, November 11, 2012 by BK

 Q2435 RR Signal?  I spotted this signal mounted on a post in a neighbor's yard today. Any idea what it is, or what it's application? There was an extensive street railway system here in Portland, not to mention several interurbans and conventional railroads. Thank you.   [Click on image for larger version.] Posted Tuesday, November 6, 2012 by Jim   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. This is an early traffic light for automobiles. The link is to a 1930 photo of a downtown Portland street corner, with one of these lights prominently installed on the far left street corner. This photo is one of a very interesting series of photos supplied by the Portland City Auditor's office. For the railroad light enthusiasts, take a look at the second link, a 1910 image from the same source, of the 'first traffic signal in Portland' which looks like maybe they stole it directly off a switchstand; kerosene lamp included!  Link 1  Link 2  Posted Tuesday, November 6, 2012 by RJMc

A. Dietz lists the second one in it's 1913 catalog. Posted Wednesday, November 7, 2012 by BK

A. As to the actual purpose of the light (when installed on the street corner) the more I look at the 1930 photo the more I suspect it had some function other than just 'stop and go' for traffic; it looks more something like a 'walk - don't walk' light for pedestrians, or maybe something like a police call light; there ARE street car tracks in the street, so maybe it even did have some special rail function, but very hard to guess at this late date. But you can clearly see in the photo, on the opposite nearer street corner, a similar light fixture but set up as a 'standard' stop-and-go light for the cars, with shields over the lenses, etc. etc. Posted Wednesday, November 7, 2012 by RJMc

A. It is an Acme traffic signal, the blue lens should be green and on the side there should be semaphore arms for Stop and Go. Posted Friday, November 9, 2012 by WM

A. The links are for You Tube videos of restored operating Acme traffic signals with the stop and go arms. The small light on the bottom is the caution light which flashes before the red light turns on. There is also a bell that rings just before the light changes. Link 1  Link 2  Posted Friday, November 9, 2012 by KM

A.  There is a great 3 part article with many photos about restoring the Acme semaphore signal posted on line at Antique Trader. Acme was located in LA, and LA had 400 of these back in the 20's and 30's. The downfall for them may have been the bird nests that got built in the cavity where the semaphores went in the down position. The spike on the top of the signal was there to discourage the birds from landing. There is an Acme shown in "Who Framed Roger Rabbit". Posted Friday, November 9, 2012 by KM

 Q2432 Cleaning without Harming Copper Parts  Hello, I just purchased a dietz fire king lantern that is tin with a copper fount and copper handle (I think it's copper maybe brass but its turned green in places so I think copper) the tin is rusted so I want to clean it and restore the lantern but which method is the best for doing this without harming the copper parts? Thanks in advance for your help as I am a novice lantern restorer. [Web Editors' note: Not RR but relevant to RR projects so we're posting here.]  Posted Tuesday, October 30, 2012 by BP   Post a Reply  Email a reply

A. Toothbrush all scale or surface debris; start clean. Apply coating of naval jelly with small brush. Let it sit for about 30 mins, then work with the toothbrush. You'll see the patina turn to liquid. After thouroughly loosening the patina, wash with clean water and dry. You may have to repeat if there are tough spots. After you have the dull copper or brass with no more patina, polish with Nevr Dull for a final cleaning. Then polish to shine using Semi-Chrome or Blue Magic. I have used this method for 30+ tear and it works every time.  Posted Saturday, November 3, 2012 by IC Carpeck

A. The King Fire Dept. lanterns were made in many variations including polished brass, brass with nickle plating, bright tin plated with a copper font, and in their last years of production Dietz painted their remaining bright tin ones red. The green that you are seeing may be from a thin copper strike which is plated on before the coat of nickle is applied. The copper adheres to the steel better than nickle does and the nickle adheres better to the copper. Also copper polishes up more easily than steel. Use a magnet and determine which parts are steel, the font is probably copper, and the handle may be brass, even if the rest of the parts are steel. The link is for a short history of fire department lanterns wriiten by Michael Kuk, Chief of the Fort Polk, LA Fire Department that is from the Signal 51 Group website.  Link 1  Posted Sunday, November 4, 2012 by KM

A. The best stuff that I've found for cleaning copper is Revere Copper and Stainless cleaner. You can find it in household cleaners section. Its made to clean pots and pans. Its safe and easy to use. Posted Sunday, November 11, 2012 by Ex Sou RY